On a recent episode of This Week in Cleantech, I nominated Scott Kubly for “Cleantecher of the Week” because he courageously authored an open-kimono post on LinkedIn about Cabana’s ending.

Here’s the thing about cleantech: it’s hard. We’re disrupting powerful, mature, incumbent sectors — and they’re not just sitting around waiting for us to put them out of business. On top of that, we face all the usual challenges of launching companies in any new industrial sector.

Everyone is going to have failures. We’re going to lose jobs, accounts, and companies. I’ve learned that there are more lessons for improvement in failure than in success. Scott continues to show that same courage and openness by agreeing to be our guest on Scaling Clean.

About Tigercomm

Tigercomm is top U.S. marketing communications and public affairs firm helping clean economy companies win with customers, investors and policy makers. 

This SaaS company provides owners and operators of both utility-scale and C&I projects with digital solutions to boost production and manage the health of their assets. Raptor Maps plays a vital role in scaling the industry through software that records and tracks asset performance, digital tools for asset management and remediation challenges, and the deployment of solar robotics.

About Tigercomm

Tigercomm’s a strategic asset, not just a clean energy PR firm. Look far and wide, but you won’t find an equal … or even a close second.

As listeners know, our show engages CEOs in conversations that harvest best practices and usable tips to successfully build, run, and lead companies. Our diverse lineup has featured power sector veterans, techies, individuals with finance and energy trading backgrounds, among others.

Robin now runs the renewable SaaS company Transect. She founded her company with a mission to revolutionize the way traditional environmental consulting firms evaluate potential development sites for renewable energy projects. After dedicating 11 years to three different traditional environmental consulting firms, Robin recognized the need for change.

About Tigercomm

Tigercomm’s a strategic asset, not just a cleantech PR firm. Look far and wide, but you won’t find an equal … or even a close second.

I brought Sean on the latest episode to speak about his background in energy trading and how that helped equip him for his role as co-founder and CEO of @Amperon for the last 6 years. He describes Amperon as “the forecasting company for the energy transition.” 

Sean had some unique things to share. Here are his B3P’s (Big 3 Points):

11:31 - The clean economy sector is where everything is headed – it’s not the “clean economy” sector anymore, just the economy. Once someone starts working in this sector, it’s hard to move elsewhere because this is a good spot to be. 

18:39 - To be a great CEO means to inspire the right talent, bring them into your workplace and be a leader who demonstrates good leadership. 

29:53 - If you want to keep a high level of performance as CEO, it’s important to take care of yourself. Spend time with your family and focus on both physical and mental well-being. Release any stress outside of work so you can start each day on a good note.

That’s why I’m excited to talk to Mahesh Konduru, who is the former CEO and now board chair of ProSep, a global energy services company focused on water treatment and chemical efficiency.

Mahesh's company is private equity financed, with operations and subsidiaries in four regions around the world. He's also CEO of Momentum Technologies, a company that processes critical minerals and metals into high-purity materials with a heavy initial focus on recycling lithium batteries.

If you’re short on time, here's an overview of our conversation:

5:22 – It’s tempting to rush through team building in the fast paced, hectic environment of a startup. But doing so puts your team and company at a disadvantage. Take the time to understand the capabilities and aspirations of employees before settling into a rapid, task-completion mindset.

14:56 – The role of a CEO at a company that’s scaling technology from proof of concept to commercial is a different kind of role than a CEO at an established company.

At an early stage, you’re primarily focused on proof of concept and the path to commercialization, making your responsibilities:

1.            Always make sure there is enough cash. Always.

2.            Set the culture.

3.            Be comfortable with risk taking.

Once the company has reached profitability, the CEO’s focus shifts more to goal setting and talent retention. 

18:14 - Match the ambition of your company with the addressable market you're seeking. If the addressable market is huge, keep your ambitions huge as well. If you don't set the ambition, the capital will not follow.

24:23 - CEOs ‘inheriting’ a new team – rather than creating one, as a startup – have a particular challenge in gaining the trust of their new employees. One unconventional way to build a strong team is job shadowing – literally. Spend a day watching your employees in action to understand the full scope of their responsibilities and observe the ways your leadership could make their jobs easier.

That’s why I’m excited to talk to Mahesh Konduru, who is the former CEO and now board chair of ProSep, a global energy services company focused on water treatment and chemical efficiency.

Mahesh's company is private equity financed, with operations and subsidiaries in four regions around the world. He's also CEO of Momentum Technologies, a company that processes critical minerals and metals into high-purity materials with a heavy initial focus on recycling lithium batteries.

If you’re short on time, here's an overview of our conversation:

5:22 – It’s tempting to rush through team building in the fast paced, hectic environment of a startup. But doing so puts your team and company at a disadvantage. Take the time to understand the capabilities and aspirations of employees before settling into a rapid, task-completion mindset.

14:56 – The role of a CEO at a company that’s scaling technology from proof of concept to commercial is a different kind of role than a CEO at an established company.

At an early stage, you’re primarily focused on proof of concept and the path to commercialization, making your responsibilities:

1.            Always make sure there is enough cash. Always.

2.            Set the culture.

3.            Be comfortable with risk taking.

Once the company has reached profitability, the CEO’s focus shifts more to goal setting and talent retention. 

18:14 - Match the ambition of your company with the addressable market you're seeking. If the addressable market is huge, keep your ambitions huge as well. If you don't set the ambition, the capital will not follow.

24:23 - CEOs ‘inheriting’ a new team – rather than creating one, as a startup – have a particular challenge in gaining the trust of their new employees. One unconventional way to build a strong team is job shadowing – literally. Spend a day watching your employees in action to understand the full scope of their responsibilities and observe the ways your leadership could make their jobs easier.

I don’t know about you, but everywhere I go, and everyone I hear from in cleantech leadership is wrestling with the same thing: Where to find talent in a tight labor market. At Tigercomm, we’re having clients ask us to build their corporate communications partly to support recruitment, which is a relatively recent development. 

Our guest today is someone with 20 years’ experience solving that problem, much of it for clean economy companies. And as someone running a company that’s also looking for talent, I’m really looking forward to talking with Paige Carratturo, the San Francisco-based co-founder of Sea Change, which describes itself as “a talent venture company.” I suspect that if anyone can give clean economy leaders useful advice on handling this super-tight labor market, it’s Paige. I also think that the way Paige’s shop pursues its mission will equip her with some longer-term insights into what work environments and interview processes are best suited for today’s talent pool. 

14:55 – To stay current on the talent pool, a leader needs to be regularly talking to potential candidates. Communicate with your team regularly about market conditions, spend time with your customers, and attend industry events. Don’t be afraid to lean on recruiters to get a detailed understanding of the talent market that comes from speaking with candidates daily.

16:50 - The ‘cool’ factor isn’t enough to draw in cleantech talent anymore. Top talent most values a healthy work culture, the flexibility to follow their passion at work and be able to affect huge issues like climate change, and strong company missions that align with their values.

18:50 - To be a successful recruiter, communicate with your candidates as you would a customer - transparency and clarity about the interview process makes candidates feel prioritized. Each person at your company who talks to a candidate should have a different goal for the conversation to ultimately make a hire based on data, not just gut feelings.

She's also led both GridNEXT and the Texas Renewable Energy Industries Alliance. In her current role, she helps developers connect to the increasingly complex power grid through both consulting services and SaaS offerings. 

3:38 - Slow down. Take the time to find what you are genuinely passionate about. Then, once you’re there, never say no to new opportunities. 

7:30 - Grow your company by delivering the impossible. Build an organization with a handful of people that understand the grid from every aspect: distribution, transmission, generation…everything.

13:44 - Look for people who are motivated to drive on their own. You want your hiring to be aligned with your approach to drive business growth. You want to deliver quality and relevance before you think about the revenue component of things. Invest in the future, not just the present. 

2:11 - We need to scale up renewables to make it a larger portion of our electricity supply, but to do so, we need a new grid model and new technologies such as battery storage and transmission enhancements.

19:04 - There have been missteps in managing the solar supply chain issue. While we’ve aimed to reduce dependence on imported solar panels from China, the transition takes time, and we still need materials from China in the short term.

24:01 - The most important barrier to the clean energy transition is transmission. We need to aggressively pursue new transmission policy that deals with streamlining the siting and permitting of new high voltage transmission lines across the country, in combination with new transmission tech, including grid enhancing tech. This needs to be deployed in existing transmission quarters but also new ones.

And Tom Starrs is our precedent-setting guest for a reason. While he's done a lot of things in a career spanning 21 years in five different companies, Tom is, by my reckoning, the longest tenured and most experienced clean tech government affairs and communications lead in America. 

And as the accelerating clean energy transition meets growing pushback from the fossil fuel lobby, the future of success of our sectors is not certain. 

Clean economy companies are often disrupting powerful incumbents with decades of experience in weaponizing government influence and propaganda against market threats for newcomers like us. 

A year after the IRA's passage, it felt like a good time to bring Tom on for his institutional knowledge and his seasoned perspective. I think you're gonna enjoy and benefit from his wisdom. 

Whether or not you work in government affairs, you need Tom's wisdom to make sure your company moves forward.

We need to scale up renewables to make it a larger portion of our electricity supply, but to do so, we need a new grid model and new technologies such as battery storage and transmission enhancements.

12:45 - Net metering had many economic benefits, but that wasn’t enough to make the technology widely adopted due to other barriers such as utilities disliking the idea. They had concerns about the safety and performance of the new tech, but it ended up being 

more reliable than they initially thought.

14:17 - Regulatory barriers, not related to the economic viability of solar, can create obstacles for customers who want to generate clean energy. It’s important to address these obstacles in advance, so that when cleantech becomes economically competitive, we can deploy it without facing these hurdles later on.

Instead, he’s the CEO of NineDot Energy, a New York-based laboratory for clean energy business model innovation. Today I’m tapping David’s varied, fascinating career for management and leadership tips we can use in running our businesses.

6:39 – Follow the 1-10-100 rule. When you identify an issue early, it costs you a point. If you put off solving it, it costs you 10 points. If you really let it fester, it costs you 100 points. Help the future you and make the hard decisions early.

10:06 – Policy that determines whether your company’s product or service will be adopted depends on actions taken by local utilities and local government. All of these are moving pieces – and they're moving regularly. It is the ecosystem of policies that can enable or destroy opportunities for the adoption of clean energy. 

20:02 – As a company, NineDot Energy prioritizes behavioral interviews to eliminate, or at least weed out, biases so that they can hire and develop a new cohort of values-based learners with different environments.

23:46 – What makes him optimistic: This new generation of young people care deeply about the planet that they are inheriting. It’s a belief system they will pass onto their children and grandchildren. “The interest level and the caliber of this generation gives me great hope that climate issues are going to be addressed by people with the right motivations, the right skills, the right talent, and the right commitment.”

01:47 – Hone in on your listening skills, and never assume you’re the smartest person in the room. The best leader is someone who can listen and enable the

people around them.

10:32 – Even if you hire someone with phenomenal technical skills and experience, you are setting them up for failure without a robust onboarding process, geared to understanding how they work. Nick’s company has each new hire, regardless of position, meet him in a brief, a 5-minute introductory

conversation to ensure a strong cultural fit from the start.

20:09 – Resist the urge to have a laser focus on only strategy as CEO. You need to be the biggest believer in the vision of the company. And, you need to be

plugged in to the entire company’s ecosystem.

24:57 - The CEO who builds in downtime and knows how to prioritize will always outlast the CEO who works 24/7.

27:26 – If you think of the interview process as a two-way street and emphasize cultural fit as well as technical skills, you’ll have happier employees who stay longer at the company.

Our thanks to Nick Cohen for sharing his experience with our listeners.

Strap in for some well-earned wisdom on building and running successful companies. 

3:31 – Just like any job, being a manager requires specific training. But most managers are

promoted without it – and it's hurting the clean economy. 

8:07 – Schedule your leisure and family time into your calendar alongside work to avoid

burnout. 

14:53 – A key takeaway from years of cleantech company management: “Half pennies matter

now. And when half pennies matter, you need to look at operational efficiencies, not just

product efficiencies.” 

16:03 – To excel as a CEO, it’s not about convincing people to do the job but convincing them

to want to do the job.

7:33 - Rather than always trying to insulate your company from failure, build a team that will excel and bounce back when things go wrong (it’s inevitable!)

10:27 - Her advice for recent grads and early career professionals: to find fulfillment in your job, you should be dedicated to exploration throughout your whole career.

16:15 - There is a huge opportunity for farmers to make additional streams of income from leasing their land to solar and wind farms.

26:10 - Her go-to hiring question: “What do you get excited about?”

lessons on building teams and running companies. All our guests to date have developed their

leadership abilities by ascending a career ladder, and they’ve done that across several companies.

Today’s guest has instead learned his leadership lessons on the job, so to speak. Jesse Grossman

founded Soltage 17 years ago, and he’s led since then as Chairman and CEO. Soltage is a New

Jersey-based utility-scale solar IPP company that was founded on the belief that capital cost

shouldn’t stop the spread of solar.

I met Jesse several years ago through the sponsor of this episode, Cleantech Leaders Roundtable,

and it’s great to reconnect with him today.

15:39: In the unfamiliar, high-pressure environment of an early-stage company, clear team roles

and communication are absolutely crucial. Resolve any confusion about responsibilities sooner

rather than later.

25:23 – In his many years of socializing with CEOs, he’s noticed that successful ones are:

 Serious subject matter experts

 Passionate about learning

 People with broad interests and experiences

39:43 – Your business model is like a scientific hypothesis, and it’s your job to test if it works,

not just to tell people you think it will. For young aspiring startup CEOs, the most important

thing you can do is pitch your business concept to a variety of people. Ask friends, family,

colleagues and experts in your field to poke holes in it.

41:05 – In hiring for a senior role, start planning a few quarters ahead – then assume it will take

longer than planned. Ask job candidates about their hobbies to both change up the flow of the

interview and to see how they express their passions.

some.gov experience to boot. Most know her as the head of the Clean Energy

Buyer's Alliance, but her experience runs a gamut that includes stints as a

sustainability director of Walmart Consulting through David Gardner Associates,

and as Air Force Assistant Secretary, managing energy budgets for 170 military

installations. She also was CEO of Toronto-based Constant Power that develops

distributed energy projects.

6:40 - Don’t feel pressured to automatically accept a promotion and encourage

your employees to do the same. With any job change, ask yourself: Which of the

jobs allows me to make the greatest difference for my organization? Which job

would allow me to, um, have the most positive impact in the world? Which job is

just going to be the most fun?

17:45 - In addition to developing the culture and vision of a company, a CEO

needs to be adept at resourcing and problem solving. The more senior you get,

the more complex problems you are expected to solve. Learn to prioritize

problems and outsource the smaller ones to managers when you can.

18:51 - Learn whether you are an entrepreneur or INTRApreneur. The skillsets

required to influence and persuade and move big systems (intrapreneur skills)

are absolutely critical in the climate change movement.

31:31 - The most successful hiring panels have a diverse set of interviewers (in

job title, seniority, race, gender, experience). And make sure your questions for

interviewees account for different ways of thinking.

42:12 - Building a strong culture for your company is imperative, not a nice-to-

have. You will see negative impacts if culture fit and cooperation is neglected.

That's why I wanted to learn more about how Kevin does it:

5:34 - A vital, underused leadership skill: Analyzing - instead of assuming - how much management a team member actually needs. This varies from person to person.

15:59 - A "blame-free" workplace is imperative to encourage risk taking, but it's not accountability-free.

20:08 - Team diversity is the right thing to do for society and for business because it creates an environment that fosters innovation.

21:44 - Servant leadership - the idea that the leader needs their staff just as much as the staff needs a leader - gives a company a competitive edge.

31:35 - When it comes to tough business decisions, making the wrong choice is better than no action at all. Some of the best lessons come from mistakes.

Jing is now the chief growth officer of Tigo Energy, a company accelerating the adoption of solar energy worldwide through innovative solar power conversion and storage products. She has a wealth of insights from her career of building and managing teams in the clean technology sector, some of which were international in their scope and their focus.

Timestamps:

3:55 — When faced with the challenges of managing multinational teams within global companies, it’s important to understand differences in culture and normal business practices. But building trust as a leader is just as important – and it’s universal.

6:08 — In managing trans-Pacific teams, Jing observes that in China, many young employees aren’t inclined to challenge assumptions of their superiors. To overcome that dynamic, it’s important to go the extra step to create a company culture that empowers everyone to share their opinions.

12:42 — When hiring, Jing advises that employers remember that many potentially game-changing new hires have less than 10 years of work experience. During the interview process, she focuses on learning how candidates perform under stress and multitasking demands. Are they good with people? Are they detail-oriented?

Find out more about Tigercomm’s work at the center of the cleantech industry at www.tigercomm.us.

Our goal on Scaling Clean is to aggregate insights from CEOs, investors and advisors on building and running winning teams at clean economy companies. I am really excited to share this interview with our listeners because Silvia has experience as a key part of #cleantech teams in four countries on both sides of the Atlantic. She is a rich source of culturally-portable management lessons invaluable on the global stage.

Timestamps:

1:08 — As a female professional, the importance of having exposure to strong female role models who can show that women’s business voices deserve to be heard.

8:45 — Working in cleantech is “almost a lifestyle,” differing from other sectors because employees are passionate. That passion makes running a cleantech company easier, because employees see they’re working towards something bigger than themselves.

12:59 — Diverse teams have a more comprehensive understanding of the challenges facing their company.

20:15 — Hiring is difficult because decisions often must be made with a limited amount of interaction with a job candidate. Trust your instincts and have another interviewer in the room for additional perspective.

23:39 — Firing is the hardest part of the job. Be prepared and thoughtful, and have specific examples of what triggered the dismissal.

24:46 — Being a CEO can be a lonely position. Learn to enjoy the role. It makes making tough decisions easier. Surround yourself with people you trust, but who also challenge you and make you better.

Find out more about Tigercomm’s work at the center of the cleantech industry at www.tigercomm.us.

South African-native Claus Nussgruber leads Utility Global, a net-zero hydrogen company based in Houston. He spent his 31-year career working in and leading corporate initiatives focused on hydrogen and other rare industrial gasses. To me, Claus represents the influx of talent that’s coming into cleantech from other parts of the economy. They’re diversifying the available expertise and perspective, and we’re the better for it.

And you’re going to be better for listening to Claus. While we like to keep our takeaways to five or fewer, this was one of those interviews that overflowed with so many great nuggets of wisdom that we just couldn’t winnow the list past this.

Timestamp:

2:40 – How Nelson Mandel taught Claus to level set his experience of frustrating situations and irritating people.

6:19 – Corporate leadership is not about issuing instructions. Rather, it’s about creating a common goal and organizing the team effectively around it.

9:19 – Running a cleantech company is about realizing potential. Running a company in a more mature space is about maintaining the potential that’s already been achieved.

11:15 – New companies don’t have brand, so the clean economy CEO is the catalyst for the brand’s buildout.

15:17 – Why Claus hired an in-house coach and made the coach available to all of his employees.

18:19 – How opera serves the same purpose for Claus’s CEO performance as ice baths serve athletes.

Find out more about Tigercomm’s work at the center of the cleantech industry at www.tigercomm.us.

Our conversation for Scaling Clean was incredibly rich. You can hear the first half of the conversation on last week’s episode. In last week’s episode, John described the attributes such as active listening and mentorship that are keys to successful entrepreneurship.

Part two is just as interesting. John and I discuss hiring, how an effective CEO inspires change in his team, and the key determinants of success in cleantech companies.

Timestamps:

1:51 — CEOs should accomplish 5 things for their company. One is being the primary storyteller, because a company is primarily defined by its story.

08:23 — When John hires, he’s looking not just for the right skills, but also the right fit with Soluna’s workplace culture. Finding the right fit requires a detailed interview process that seeks the decision-making patterns of prospective employees.

12:40 — Companies struggle to hire diverse people because people largely work through their professional networks. When people don’t have diverse networks, it’s difficult to hire diverse people. Continuously expand your network and reach out to professional organizations focused on diversity.

14:41 — Focus is a key part of success. Do something well, better than anyone else, and focus on that part of the business. Distraction can lead to disaster.

18:32 — To successfully change the sector and change the world, you need to convince people why they need to change. If there is a customer problem your company addresses, you need to talk about that problem and show how you are the team best equipped to help. When customer prospects see the problem, they’ll think of you as a solution because you already built an audience.

Find out more about Tigercomm’s work at the center of the clean technology industry at www.tigercomm.us.

John Belizaire is CEO of Soluna Computing, which builds modular green data centers running on renewable energy. Though he just turned 50, John has already sold two companies. In his current role, he testified before the U.S. Congress and rang the NASDAQ bell. His speaking and writing attract the interests of new and legacy media, including Cheddar News, The New York Times and The Wall Street Journal.

Plus, John is also a thoroughly wonderful human being, with an informative perspective on building and running the companies looking to grow our industry.

Our conversation for Scaling Clean was incredibly rich, so much so that our conversation ran double the normal time. When we went to cut the conversation down to our normal 30 minutes, we realized Scaling Clean listeners would benefit more if we just split the conversation into two parts. Here is the first half, in which John describes how active listening and grit are key to successful entrepreneurship.

Timestamps:

11:48 — The valuable lessons of being a boss. Leadership is about setting direction for the team, not about titles.

14:23 — The role of mentorship and how to seek out mentors. John found mentors by being proactive, cold-calling potential connections.

18:56 — So, why clean tech? What brought John to renewables? Part of John’s job is shifting people’s perceptions of the world and how energy fits therein. But how has he prioritized innovation through 25 years in the industry? Focus, and making that 1% change everyday. Show people how the industry is changing and convince them that the way you’re doing it is the right way moving forward.

28:19 — People gravitate to the safe choice. Make sure to reject the urge. Reject the conventional wisdom. What role does technology play in innovation? Sometimes it drives change, sometimes it becomes a crutch.

Find out more about Tigercomm’s work at the center of the clean technology industry at www.tigercomm.us.

But first, a bit of context; the climate destruction crisis keeps accelerating, and yet here in the U.S. we waste an astounding 40% of all the electricity we generate. We can and should – build a lot of renewable energy capacity. But if we keep wasting nearly half of what we produce, we’re not going to move the American economy onto a more sustainable footing.

That’s why those who are driving outcomes in the workhorse sector of energy efficiency are some of the unsung leaders of the clean economy. And today I get to talk with one of those leaders who is avowedly out to build a profitable company and “save the world” from energy waste by eliminating the friction in energy efficiency.

Al Subbloie is the CEO of the energy efficiency as a service company, Budderfly, based in Shelton, Connecticut. Budderfly has 125 employees operating in 49 states with a growth rate of well over 50% for this year. And this is the third company Al’s built.

As Al describes it, he “starts companies, and then runs them for a long time.”

That’s why I know you’ll find this episode rich in lessons on how to build and run dynamic cleantech companies.

Highlights:

5:05 – Boss vs. leaders, and why leaders drive better growth companies. Bosses

manages tasks to a specific outcome, a leader develops and hold the vision.

8:26 – There are huge differences in running a clean economy company,

because you’re not just trying to drive a company’s profits, but also save the

world with the same pace as building the company. That’s an enrolling vision,

that makes it easier to lead a team because they have a shared vision.

11:10 – Energy efficiency is a neglected, but profitable opportunity because no

one measures energy waste over roughly 45 different things that a building’s

owner can do. Each requires the owner writing a check, the reward for which is a

utility bill, which is a poorly designed ROI document.

13:43 – The growth-oriented CEO is a leader who sets vision, builds a team to

executes, then communicates a lot to several core constituencies, including

board members, investors, customers and employees.

17:41 – The energy sector has “awesome” macro dynamics, something you

should look for but are hard to steer or influence.

19:32 – How multiple interviews of a candidate help with hiring for skills and

cultural alignment, because the combination makes growth much more efficient.

And cultures last a long time. Al asks candidates: “What drives you” to test for

cultural fit.

23:52 – You’ll always take longer to fire someone than you should have.

29:31 – Energy efficiency is a $250B business opportunity.

Host Mike Casey speak to Kimberlee Centera, President and CEO of TerraPro Solutions. Kimberlee is a trailblazer in the renewable energy sector who has helped build over 10,000 renewable energy projects in the U.S. alone. She can accurately be described as an “OC,” an “original clean-techer,” and has been involved in land-use questions her entire professional life. 

If you look up “breadth of development” experience on Wikipedia, Kimberlee’s photo ought to be the visual. That’s why we were thrilled to have Kimberlee on Scaling Clean. 

Here are the highlights for our conversation with this long-time cleantech leader:

5:35 – It’s tough to address weaknesses while developing your leadership skills, but it can be an opportunity to build

your strengths.

8:00 – Ask your boss how they see your growth. Don’t assume they are paying attention.

9:20 – The work world has changed – but not enough – for women since Centera started her

career.

16:00 – Clean economy’s volatility and risk make it different than working in more mature sectors.

18:40 – How corporate values makes hiring easier, and why you can’t coach character.

24:16 – Key advice for the new CEO: There’s power in humility and listening. Talk last in the

meeting.

29:15 – Innovations + new talent coming into cleantech inspire Centera to be an optimist about the future of the clean economy.

Thanks for listening. Like and subscribe to Scaling Clean wherever you listen to podcasts. And leave a review to tell us what you think.