Transcript:

00:00:00

Xochitl

You are listening to the Jack and Chill podcast Jack. Today we have a little bit of a heavy topic brief Jack.

00:00:20

Xochitl

Your experiences with grief and how would you define it for our listeners?

00:00:24

발표자

OK.

00:00:25

Jack

Yeah. So grief is A is a a tough topic and for our listeners out there, grief is the emotion that you feel when.

00:00:33

Jack

Someone that you you loved, a loved one passes away or or dies.

00:00:39

Jack

And for me, I I never really experienced it.

00:00:47

Jack

I I I didn’t experience it for a long time because when I was born my 2 two of my grandparents were had already passed away or passed away when I was a baby. So you I just grew up never knowing my my grandfather on my father’s side.

00:01:07

Jack

And I grew up not knowing my grandmother on my mother’s side and my grandfather on my mother’s side was alive. But we we weren’t really in contact with him. He was an abusive alcohol.

00:01:22

Jack

Alec and so growing up, there was a lot of.

00:01:29

Jack

Stress in my my mother’s family because of my grandfather’s drinking and and when he was when I was in middle or sorry, elementary school, maybe fifth grade during summer camp, my grandfather passed away in a nursing home and my parents.

00:01:49

Jack

Ask me, you know, do you want to go to the funeral?

00:01:52

Jack

We’ll come pick you.

00:01:52

Jack

Up or you can just stay at camp and.

00:01:57

Jack

I just stayed at camp and I I really felt nothing. I, I I remember meeting him one time in the nursing home and it was just scary, you know, because it was all all these.

00:02:10

Jack

Elderly, sick people, very thin and.

00:02:15

Jack

I he I just. I didn’t have any relationship with him at all. So I I really only had my my father’s mother, my grandmother, and my father my father’s side.

00:02:28

Jack

And she we called her Bubba. Uh and Bubba was the best. You know? She really.

00:02:39

Jack

Filled in for all the for the other three grandparents that didn’t have I I wouldn’t trade, you know, four grandparents for for one, Bubba and yeah, ever. Because she was amazing. And and she lived to be 92 years old.

00:02:57

Jack

And so she passed. Maybe in, like, 2009. I think if I’m not mistaken, somewhere around there. Uh, my daughter was just a baby at the time and.

00:03:10

Jack

And I I felt.

00:03:11

Jack

Very, very sad, obviously because it’s it’s hard when you lose someone that you.

00:03:18

Jack

Of but I also, on the other hand, she lived to be 92 years old, like she lived a very full life, a very long life. Yeah, I grew up in the Great Depression in America, in on a farm in South Dakota. So she was tough, you know.

00:03:27

Xochitl

Right.

00:03:38

Jack

Tough as nails like there is no, she didn’t. She wasn’t a, you know, delicate person. You know, she grew up in the hard times in America and she.

00:03:55

Jack

Married my my grandfather, who was a a mechanic in the military. He served in Panama building of the Panama Canal during World War 2. So, you know, it was there just just that famous, you know, kind of story.

00:04:15

Jack

1950s, they had their children. They grew up in the 50s and 60s. My my father was in elementary school in the 50s and then high school and university in the 60s and early 70s.

00:04:29

Jack

And so that was my first experience with with grief. But in the last three about three years ago, my one of my very, very close friends, I probably I have a best friend from high school and a best friend from college.

00:04:48

Jack

And my best friend from college passed away, and that was.

00:04:57

Jack

You know it’s.

00:05:00

Jack

He he was young, you know. I mean, not not. Maybe not not, you know, not not like in his 20s. He was in his his 40s but.

00:05:10

Xochitl

That’s young to pass. That’s very young to pass.

00:05:11

Jack

Yeah, that’s that’s very young to pass. And and that was that one.

00:05:18

Jack

You know, stop me in my tracks. You know, it was. That was a very, very difficult one to process and I think I’m, you know, still processing it and and probably will always be processing it in some way because.

00:05:36

Jack

It just leaves a a massive hole in your in your heart, in your life, where?

00:05:45

Jack

Something will happen and you, you you want that person’s advice or you want to tell that person and you and you remember that they’re not here and and you can’t. You can’t tell them and you’ll never laugh together. You’ll, you know you you won’t. You’re not going to share a moment again.

00:06:06

Jack

And everything you had with that person is everything you will ever have with that person. And that’s a very here’s an English expression for our listeners, a hard pill to swallow. You know, it’s hard to accept that reality that.

00:06:23

Jack

This. That’s it. You know, the time that you had is the time is the is the only time that you.

00:06:29

Jack

You get with that person and.

00:06:32

Jack

It just seems cruel, you know that an illness would.

00:06:40

Jack

UM.

00:06:42

Jack

Affect someone that young and and take them away from from from their family and from their friend?

00:06:48

Jack

And and and yeah, it just it just kind of.

00:06:55

Jack

I don’t know what the word is like. I’ve it it it it it’s it has like a dulling effect. Like it a a numbing effect. Yeah. It it leaves you kind of like.

00:07:08

Jack

It it could be dangerous because it can make you cynical, right? Like it can make you kind of angry at the world or angry at God or or or just kind of like, what’s the point of of all this? Because.

00:07:24

Jack

Anyone that we love can just be torn away from us at any moment.

00:07:28

Jack

Or but but that’s the the that’s the anger stage of grief. I think you know where you’re just you get angry and you you don’t. You shouldn’t stay. You don’t want to stay in that mindset. You know, of of anger.

00:07:29

Xochitl

Right.

00:07:45

Jack

You want to move on to acceptance.

00:07:49

Jack

And appreciate and be happy and and blessed that you at least the time that you did have with that person be be lucky that you’re able to have that time with that person, but it’s hard to get to to that stage of grief. I think it it does take a lot of kind of its internal struggle within yourself.

00:08:10

Jack

It takes.

00:08:13

Jack

A more mature kind of.

00:08:17

Jack

Approach to life and understanding that wow, you know, like life is very delicate and it’s not as nothing is guaranteed. And so it’ll make you hug that your loved ones that are still here a.

00:08:32

Jack

Little bit harder.

00:08:34

Jack

And you know what I mean? Like, in, in that moment.

00:08:37

Jack

Now for example, I was in America recently and I got to see my daughter and even though she was embarrassed, I I I made sure to hug her and tell her I love her. When I said goodbye to her.

00:08:52

Jack

I I didn’t care if if it embarrassed her friends or anything and she didn’t care either because, you know, it’s like that you you never, ever know. There are no guarantees in in life. And so those are that was my my take away from my experience with grief and.

00:09:12

Jack

How? How? How about you? Like how? How have you been dealing with with your experiences with grief?

00:09:20

Xochitl

Well, for our listeners, I think there is an important concept about the stages of grief in the United States. We call them like the five stages of grief and their denial, which is like kind of denying that it happened, glossing over it. You really don’t feel any of those feelings you’re kind of.

00:09:41

Xochitl

It’s hard to process or even perceive that it really happened. Then there’s anger, which is, of course, being angry about what happened or feeling like, you know, it was unfair. There’s the bargaining stage, which is the stage where you’re like, oh, it’s only this had happened, maybe they wouldn’t have passed. If only this had happened. If I had done this differently.

00:10:00

Xochitl

They had done this differently. If the doctors had done this differently.

00:10:03

Xochitl

And this all wouldn’t have happened. And then there’s a depression stage, which is kind of where your feelings get the best of you. And you’re starting, you’re in the midst of processing them. I feel like and.

00:10:15

Xochitl

You feel a.

00:10:16

Xochitl

Great sadness. It’s hard to get out of bed. It’s hard to do your daily tasks and the last stage is acceptance, which is what Jack was talking about, where you accept.

00:10:26

Xochitl

What has happened and you can maybe take some valuable lessons or, you know, move forward with.

00:10:33

Xochitl

A better understanding of what occurred.

00:10:36

Xochitl

I think it’s hard for me because.

00:10:39

Xochitl

You can, uh. Contrary to popular belief, you can experience these in any order, and you can also experience the the cycle multiple times.

00:10:48

Xochitl

And for me, what I struggle with the most.

00:10:52

Xochitl

Is I.

00:10:56

Xochitl

And the kind of person that.

00:10:59

Xochitl

I don’t think I process. I don’t think I process my feelings because I see everyone else around me crying and stuff and I’m just standing there awkwardly and I do cry sometimes but it but not it’s like I.

00:11:17

Xochitl

It’s not like an in the moment thing like how I see everyone else going through stages in the moment. It’s kind of like.

00:11:26

Xochitl

I feel like a third person watching everything happen. You know what I mean? I don’t know if this resonates at all.

00:11:31

Jack

Yeah, there’s a word for that. It’s it’s disassociation, right?

00:11:35

Xochitl

Yeah, I kind of disassociate. It’s like you’re. It’s like watching a a life movie. But it’s your life. But you’re watching it as if it weren’t your life, as if it’s a movie or you’re seeing it in the third.

00:11:48

Jack

Yeah, that that’s a coping mechanism, I think.

00:11:51

Xochitl

Yeah, it is a coping mechanism. Yeah. And that’s definitely how I. It’s like a faulty. It’s known as a faulty coping mechanism, which is like an unhealthy coping mechanism. And the only one that I experience a lot because.

00:12:04

Xochitl

Well, in Mexican tradition, there’s a lot that.

00:12:09

Xochitl

Is different. I think different from us tradition and it was.

00:12:13

Xochitl

Things that were really hard for me to experience because it’s my grandmother passing was the first time that I was actually here for someone in my family passing and it’s the Mexican side. So we did everything the Mexican way and that means like, as she was.

00:12:27

Xochitl

Passing away, we were we all had to be in.

00:12:30

Xochitl

The room with her.

00:12:33

Xochitl

So we were watching our part. We were in the hospital with her non-stop. Pretty much. My mom slept there every single night in the ICU and the rest of us were there pretty much every single day and night at different varying times.

00:12:51

Xochitl

When they took out life.

00:12:52

Xochitl

Support with like watch her pass but it was very hard because.

00:12:56

Xochitl

Death isn’t like the movies, where they’re like, unconnected someone from life support, and they just, like, quietly pass like they’re falling asleep.

00:12:57

발표자

OK.

00:13:05

Xochitl

It’s not really what happens. I don’t really need to serve any of our viewers, but like they people kind of gasp for breath, for breath, for a long time when they’re unhooked from life support. Probably in my experience they can have an immediate collapse that does happen. But what happened with my grandmother is that she kept.

00:13:23

Xochitl

Gasping for air for a long time, but she wasn’t like there. Mentally, like she couldn’t speak. She didn’t even know we were there. She didn’t respond. Like if I.

00:13:31

Xochitl

Like waved my hand over her eyes to see she’s like her eyes were clouded over, but it was like her body, her lungs still gasping for breath, and this went on for like.

00:13:42

Xochitl

I wanna say like 24 hours. Uhm, I wanna say and UM.

00:13:50

Xochitl

It was really hard and then you have to stay with the body overnight in Mexican tradition, so you can’t, like, go home and you have to sleep in the hospital.

00:13:58

Xochitl

With the body or whatever.

00:14:01

Xochitl

UM, once a person has passed away, the body can’t be alone the first night. So my aunt, my mom, my sister slept.

00:14:10

Xochitl

I went home because I was sick and I had already slept in the hospital. Like two nights I wanted to. Yeah, just like in, in a chair, because there wasn’t any, like, beds or anything for us to sleep in. And I just couldn’t take it anymore. I don’t know how everyone else did it. I felt like sick, like, I could barely.

00:14:30

Xochitl

Function at that point.

00:14:31

Jack

Sure. And emotionally, you are just that, was it? You were.

00:14:37

Xochitl

Yeah, I couldn’t do anymore. I sell exhausted, physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually. And I I don’t know how other people push through. It’s like I just couldn’t do it. It had been days. It really been over a month since my aunt. I had a good night’s sleep because my grandmother had been sick all the time, and we had been watching her and my sister and my mother flew in and.

00:14:57

Xochitl

They hadn’t, really.

00:14:58

Xochitl

They had been resting up until that.

00:15:01

Xochitl

Point. So they really had.

00:15:03

Xochitl

To take over some stuff for us, but.

00:15:05

Xochitl

That was really hard part. And then the other.

00:15:07

Xochitl

Hard part was.

00:15:09

Xochitl

UM.

00:15:11

Xochitl

Once you know she passed and everything before the cremation like we had to see her body.

00:15:16

Xochitl

And that’s still hard because people’s bodies it changes once they pass, like their skin changes. It was like purple, and I won’t go into details just, you know, scar our audience or anything. But it was very difficult and it was difficult for me because it’s like my sister and my aunt. My mom were all.

00:15:37

Xochitl

Crying and I was just standing there like.

00:15:40

Xochitl

Disassociating I was humming a song that she really liked, that my grandmother really liked, that her favorite song I was like humming that, but I was checked out. I like was not there.

00:15:49

Xochitl

At all and it’s.

00:15:50

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:15:51

Xochitl

Weird to see everyone like crying over the body and I was just like I was in outer space. I was not. I was not there and I was not crying.

00:16:01

Xochitl

And so I think it’s weird how everyone processes grief differently, but I think you.

00:16:05

Xochitl

Can feel weird when.

00:16:07

Xochitl

Everyone else is kind of processing in a similar way, and you’re like the odd one out.

00:16:12

Jack

Yeah, that is. I mean, I I really get upset when people judge the way.

00:16:19

Jack

People grieve because I I think I’m same as you. It’s almost. It’s almost like an overload, you know? Like the like. When the computer freezes.

00:16:32

Jack

You know, there’s just. There’s too much. And what happens is I just kind of have an out of body experience. Like, I just kind of float away and just say like, you know, no too much can’t.

00:16:48

Jack

Can’t deal with this and I’m going to I’m I’m going to go to another dimension for a little while and catch my breath.

00:17:00

Jack

And that can.

00:17:02

Jack

Kind of cold to people from the outside, you know, looking in as you, you’re just standing there, but you’re not crying. And you, you’re you’re you just look normal, quote UN quote normal. But inside you’re you’re you’re just dealing with so much.

00:17:21

Jack

At one time that you just, you just kind of check out like you said and.

00:17:27

Jack

I I think.

00:17:29

Jack

Again I I.

00:17:30

Jack

Just think that’s like a a self preservation kind of a thing. It’s like, yeah, exactly. A coping mechanism. It’s it’s just, it’s just the way your your brain is wired. It’s like too many stressors in in one moment.

00:17:35

Xochitl

Coping mechanism.

00:17:49

Jack

And you just kind of free.

00:17:50

Jack

There’s, you know, there’s that that kind of fight flight or freeze. I don’t know if if that applies here or not, but I think it it makes what you’re describing makes perfect sense to me because I think I I process things the same way as you. But I think like when?

00:18:12

Jack

When those emotions settle down.

00:18:15

Jack

And you’ll you’ll have a moment where you will be able to process it in a more.

00:18:23

Jack

For lack of a better word, traditional way.

00:18:26

Xochitl

Right. Typical way maybe.

00:18:28

Jack

Yeah. And, you know, some people just don’t like to cry in front of other people, you know? So when I, when I when finally the floodgates opened and I I wept, it was during my during the funeral, which was took place during COVID so.

00:18:47

Jack

The uh.

00:18:49

Jack

So. So the funeral was online, so I just remember just being alone in.

00:18:57

Jack

In my office, in my house and this is like 2:00 or 3:00 in the morning. And I was just weeping.

00:19:06

Jack

And but it had taken me days to to get to that that stage where it finally hit, you know, kind of like a.

00:19:19

Jack

Like an arrow. Just boom I. It was. I was finally ready to start processing. But maybe you know the days prior to that.

00:19:32

Jack

It just seemed unreal. It’s like, you know, the this is not. This is not really happening, you know it’s it’s it’s the.

00:19:40

Jack

Kind of that kind of thing. And and I I just, I I don’t I don’t I I if there’s one take away from our talk today about grief is I just think there’s you know 6 billion people on the planet or 7 billion people and there’s probably 7 billion different ways to grieve.

00:20:01

Jack

And I, and we shouldn’t rush to judgment when people don’t follow the, quote, UN quote, traditional methods of of weeping. I I think movies have really like, like you said, when you’re describing the process.

00:20:18

Jack

Death in the movies, you know the the the person dying often just you know they’ve.

00:20:27

Jack

It’s so romanticized, you know, they kind of, you know, brush their hair back and then close their eyes and and that’s it, you know.

00:20:37

Jack

And that that’s not the the dying process. I I was listening to an interview with the lead singer of U2 talking about his father’s passing. And he he said, you know, dying is is as messy as being born.

00:20:59

Jack

You know, we we come into. Yeah. Yeah. I mean it’s it’s not a it’s it’s he. That was what that was his take away from it because he had never experienced that but taking care of his father in his final days.

00:20:59

Xochitl

Yeah, just accurate.

00:21:11

Jack

He was very surprised at just how.

00:21:16

Jack

Messy and and ugly, the process can be.

00:21:21

Jack

And and it’s so unlike.

00:21:24

Jack

You know, in the movies where it’s just so you know you’re you’re here and then you’re gone. But it’s actually a process. Death is a a slow process sometimes. You know, it can be immediate, but it can also be drawn out. And. And I don’t think we I think we we it’s it’s too.

00:21:45

Jack

It’s too ugly a thing for us to to look at and and talk about.

00:21:52

Jack

I I think we.

00:21:54

Jack

We we don’t want, we don’t want to accept that as the reality, but I think anyone working in a hospital or Hospice.

00:22:03

Jack

You know people who are in the medical profession, they they understand this reality very well.

00:22:14

Xochitl

I agree with you and.

00:22:17

Xochitl

Wear some tickles or lessons that you feel like you gained.

00:22:23

Xochitl

After you, kind of.

00:22:26

Xochitl

After things settled down from someone’s passing.

00:22:31

Jack

Yeah, I that’s a good question. And I I wonder, you know if I.

00:22:36

Jack

I I don’t know.

00:22:37

Jack

If I have any wisdom for for people, I think, well, here’s something that I think is is helpful for.

00:22:45

Jack

For people, and I think that people should remember this when someone passes the.

00:22:54

Jack

I think the worst thing you can do.

00:22:59

Jack

Try to.

00:23:02

Jack

Provide some meaning to it for the persons.

00:23:04

Xochitl

That’s true. That’s true.

00:23:06

Jack

Which I which it.

00:23:07

Jack

It it sounds.

00:23:08

Jack

Counterintuitive, you know, because you think that if you, if you could just say the one profound thing.

00:23:14

Jack

To the person at the funeral.

00:23:16

Jack

Then they will feel better.

00:23:20

Jack

But it’s it has nothing to do with it’s. It’s all about the person grieving. It’s nothing to do with you. The friend of that person. The only the only appropriate response, I think, is to just grieve together and just, just just wrap your arms around that person.

00:23:41

Jack

Hug them and say I’m so sorry for your loss that that’s it. There is nothing. There are no magic words that are going to take away the pain of of a lost one. So coming up and saying, you know, well, you know, he’s with God now or she’s with God now.

00:23:59

Xochitl

It’s all part of God’s plan and stuff like that. Everything happens for a reason. That’s one of the worst ones.

00:24:01

Jack

Right. It’s part, yeah.

00:24:04

Jack

It happened for a reason. Yeah. This because it doesn’t. There’s no reason for it. There’s no. You know what I mean? It’s not. There’s no plan. There’s no reason for it.

00:24:16

Jack

It’s just a tragedy. It’s just sad. And why is that not enough?

00:24:22

Jack

You know, I I think that should have to be enough for for us like.

00:24:28

Jack

It’s it’s just sad. It sucks.

00:24:32

Jack

And we’re going to just sit in this, but you’re not going to sit in it alone. I will sit in it with you. That’s the best thing that you can do for someone who is grieving.

00:24:45

Jack

Don’t offer any advice. Don’t. Yeah. Don’t talk about the God’s plan or anything like that. Just say this sucks and and I’m going to be here. You’re not going to go through this alone.

00:24:59

Jack

And I think that if people understood that.

00:25:04

Jack

A little bit better it it would. It would avoid a lot of those awkward.

00:25:09

Jack

Conversations you know at at where you know people are trying to provide some sort of reason or or.

00:25:17

Jack

You know.

00:25:19

Jack

Excuse for why this happened, it’s it’s just it just sucks. It’s just a terrible, terrible tragedy, tragic situation and that has to be enough. And and there is no like resolution. There’s no, there’s no third act to this sort of.

00:25:39

Jack

In this sort of situation, it’s just it’s terrible and but I’m here for you any way you need me. That’s why I think it’s it’s kind of beautiful when people kind of surround someone who has lost somebody and they cook a meal for them and deliver it.

00:25:55

Jack

You know.

00:25:56

Xochitl

Yeah, that’s one thing that like for me and going through the screening process with like with my grandmother passing and being here for my mom and my aunts like more than saying something or whatever. I wish we I wish people there were more people who brought a meal.

00:26:16

Xochitl

Over offered to to bring a meal over, or offered to help. Uh, clean out some of my grandmother’s belongings and, you know, offload some things.

00:26:27

Xochitl

And you know.

00:26:29

Xochitl

I just wish there were more people that tried to offer support in those ways because I think that’s more.

00:26:36

Jack

Yeah, the words words are are almost meaningless in those situations. I and I hate to say it because it’s. I know that people saying them are they think they’re they’re doing something.

00:26:48

Xochitl

For their well meaning.

00:26:50

Jack

They’re well meaning but.

00:26:53

Jack

I I would say.

00:26:55

Jack

You know, I’m so sorry for your loss. Big hug. And how can I help you? What do you need? Because in those moments, the last thing you want to do is be cleaning your house or cooking meals and that sort of thing. And so those little gestures are actually much more meaningful than any words.

00:27:16

Jack

That you can say at a, at a funeral or awake or anything like that.

00:27:21

Xochitl

Yeah, because that’s one of the big things we’ve been dealing with is like trying to cook.

00:27:26

Xochitl

And like wrap your heads around buying groceries and cooking. And even when we bought groceries, they like spoil because we were at the hospital all the time and.

00:27:36

Xochitl

It’s just so hard to do those basic things. I think like those are really good things you can do to support.

00:27:45

Xochitl

People, when their loved one has passed away for sure.

00:27:49

Xochitl

Jack, how about? Ohh sorry, didn’t you? I was just going to say. How about lessons you took?

00:27:51

Jack

Alright, go ahead. Go ahead. Go ahead. No, no.

00:27:57

Xochitl

From the people in your life that have passed on, you know sonned ways that you remember them and things you learned from them.

00:28:05

Jack

Yeah. Yeah, so.

00:28:07

Jack

I I think that.

00:28:11

Jack

Just thinking about my grandmother and her.

00:28:15

Jack

Her, her strength and her resolve, you know, just and also her.

00:28:22

Jack

Ability like her capacity to love was it’s seemed limitless and she she she really was.

00:28:31

Jack

A. A kind.

00:28:34

Jack

Person you know and and yeah, we we use that word kind. I think it’s overly used you know. But she was, you know she was truly a kind person.

00:28:45

Jack

UM and.

00:28:48

Jack

I I I really do.

00:28:53

Jack

I I really am so lucky that I had such a loving grandparent. I mean the this is a pretty big she was the, I mean she, she.

00:29:03

Jack

She was filling the the place of four grandparents with just the 11 grandparent. But you know, she was like a second mother, you know? It was just like we’re going to Bubba’s.

00:29:14

Jack

Was and she, you know, it was such such a traditional kind of grandmother, you know, she had chocolate chip cookies all the time. She baked pies. She, you know, she was an amazing cook. We would play board games at her house and.

00:29:30

Jack

It was just. It was.

00:29:32

Jack

Just so much fun. She was such a fun grandma.

00:29:34

Jack

And UM. Uh. Very uh.

00:29:40

Jack

Very, very loving and and and. And my friends. I mean, I could go on for days and days, but you know we he it’s it’s interesting like he he’s a friend we we never had a.

00:29:59

Jack

Like a cross.

00:30:00

Jack

Moment or anything. Do you know what I mean? Like.

00:30:04

Jack

Yeah, it was. It was just.

00:30:07

Xochitl

You just clicked.

00:30:07

Jack

Yeah. We just clicked. We just clicked our our personalities, our sense of humor just aligned perfectly. He was very much like a like an older brother for me because he was a few years older than me. And and I I I wanted to be like him. He was.

00:30:27

Jack

And he was cool. And and I looked up to him and and he was a a confidante, you know, a person that I could tell.

00:30:39

Jack

Anything too. And I knew that he would, you know, keep it. You know he wouldn’t, you know, gossip or anything like that. And it was just just a very trust, trusting person and and loved life well traveled.

00:31:00

Jack

Everybody got along with everybody. Yeah. I mean, he there’s just no one that he couldn’t get along with. Yeah, it it’s just a. It’s a huge, immense loss and.

00:31:14

Jack

I I I I I I’m so happy to have have known him. What about you? What? What what? What did you would you could you say you’ve taken away from your your grandparents?

00:31:28

Xochitl

I think one thing I learned, not directly to them, but after their passing was.

00:31:37

Xochitl

As much time there’s not, there’s never too much time spent with your loved ones because one day they might just not be there. And maybe sometimes we put it off for later, like Oh well, I’m, you know, I’m busy. I have this to do. So I I can’t, you know, come see you or whatever and then.

00:31:57

Xochitl

You know, one day you don’t even have that that option and.

00:32:02

Xochitl

It just makes you value the time that you have with with your loved ones. The times that you have with the people that you cherish that much more because you.

00:32:09

Xochitl

Realize it’s not forever.

00:32:12

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:32:14

Xochitl

UM, yeah. And the big thing I learned from my grandmother indirectly. You know, she was always telling us go live your life and enjoy your experiences. Enjoy your youth as much as you can because your loved ones kind of kind of thought process. But a lot of times she she held herself back from doing things because.

00:32:36

Xochitl

There was only something more important than her, you know, traveling or her going to do something she really wanted to do and.

00:32:48

Xochitl

It made me realize, like the moment is kind of now your life is is right here in this moment and you never know.

00:32:56

Xochitl

If tomorrow.

00:32:59

Xochitl

Is going to come and so you have to, you know, don’t.

00:33:04

Xochitl

Make your plans for later all the time. I mean, obviously there are some things that are long term goals, but as don’t leave.

00:33:14

Xochitl

Enjoyment for later every time. Don’t leave.

00:33:19

Xochitl

You know your life for later every time because it will go by in a blur it and there will be so many moments that you missed out on because you were just waiting.

00:33:31

Jack

I I think that’s a great great advice, I mean.

00:33:31

Xochitl

You enjoy.

00:33:35

Jack

I think there’s something about that generation that is.

00:33:39

Jack

You know.

00:33:42

Jack

There’s our your generation and and my generation are are different. I think. I think we’re starting to realize that, you know, and taking those lessons and and I think that the the older generation like the the baby boomer generation and and older.

00:33:59

Xochitl

Silent generation, yeah.

00:34:00

Jack

Yeah, they’re they’re kind of like.

00:34:03

Jack

My my joy. What are you talking about? What does my happiness have to do with anything? You know, like my, my happiness is irrelevant. And and that’s kind of sad. You know that. That’s the the kind of.

00:34:22

Jack

Thinking that they, you know, they’re they were always worried about their children, you know, like the the children’s happiness. And I think I think the younger generations now are starting to go, you know what? Maybe the.

00:34:37

Jack

That way, overused expression, carpe diem, you know, sees the day is.

00:34:43

Jack

Is actually. There’s some truth in that that you, you your happiness is not irrelevant. It’s OK to.

00:34:53

Jack

Have experiences chase your dreams, live your life to the fullest and and not have any regrets when you, when you pass and these kinds of sudden losses.

00:35:12

Jack

Remind us of that. I think that’s what you’re you’re getting at. It’s like, ohh yeah. I need to if I if I’m going to honor my grandmother’s life or honor my friend’s life, then I need to live my life to the fullest. And I think that’s part of the acceptance stage as well.

00:35:33

Jack

In the grief process is like you, you’re turning, you’re going to turn something terrible.

00:35:40

Jack

And try to.

00:35:43

Jack

Instead of being depressed, instead of trying to negotiate a different outcome.

00:35:48

Xochitl

Feeling negatively, yeah.

00:35:50

Jack

Exactly. You’re gonna. You’re going to live.

00:35:53

Jack

Even a little more.

00:35:56

Jack

Passionately love a little bit more intense.

00:36:00

Jack

Mostly work a little more. I don’t know. You know. Just. Yeah. Yeah. I think those are the and and and and I I I don’t. I hate to say that that’s like turning a negative into a positive because it’s not that’s not what.

00:36:07

Xochitl

Build your goals and your dreams.

00:36:20

Jack

What you’re doing, but what you’re doing is you’re honoring that person’s life by not like.

00:36:27

Jack

Dealing with, you know, getting drunk every night to try to forget about it is not honoring that person’s life. And so, and that’s how some people cope with depression and anger and denial and all those things and the acceptance stages that no, you’re you’re living healthfully, you’re still.

00:36:30

Xochitl

Right, you mean?

00:36:35

Jack

Right.

00:36:47

Jack

You still grieve that person’s the loss of that person, but.

00:36:53

Jack

You’re also living your life.

00:36:56

Jack

As fully as you possibly can to honor that person because they no longer are able to. And so, and I think that’s the that’s the most beautiful thing you can do in the wake of a tragedy like that.

00:37:14

Xochitl

Yeah, because for me, it’s like we’re cleaning out my grandmother’s things, and there’s so many things that they’re gifts that my aunt gave her that my mother gave her that were still wrapped in the packaging because they were, like, saving them for a special occasion and and middle.

00:37:34

Xochitl

Occasion was special enough.

00:37:36

Xochitl

Kind of thing, because that’s like the thinking that’s the mindset behind it is like it’s like it’s never the right moment. And I think the older generations were very much about save now, enjoy later. And I think our US younger generations are starting with enjoy now and save later.

00:37:56

Xochitl

There, there must be a balance somewhere in there, but I don’t think they found it.

00:37:58

Jack

There’s probably some like happy middle ground.

00:38:02

Jack

But you know all what do all those things mean in the in the end, you know, it’s like, you know, maybe your grandmother should have just opened those presents and let the grandchildren play with them, you know, or you know what I mean? Like, like, really experience them and touch them and look at them and.

00:38:23

Xochitl

Enjoyed them? Just enjoy her own life because I feel like she never thought about her own happiness. She didn’t really. I’m sure she had joyful moments she did. I know that as much, but it’s like I feel like so many joyful moments that she could have had she just put them to one side because her children were more important.

00:38:43

Xochitl

The grandchildren were more important. Whatever was going on was more important in the moment than taking that trip, enjoying something for herself, being selfish for once. And I think it’s just it’s so important to just.

00:39:00

Xochitl

Have those special moments for yourself sometimes.

00:39:04

Jack

I I totally agree with you and you know, I mean, what is she? What? What is she guilty of? She’s guilty of being a very selfless person, you know, and exactly, exactly. And. And that’s something that you can appreciate about her and just say, wow, what a what a a beautiful, selfless person she was.

00:39:13

Xochitl

I know which is the beautiful thing for sure.

00:39:24

Jack

And and you know, maybe she did derive great happiness.

00:39:28

Jack

On on seeing her family thrive, you know, and and do well. And and I get that as a parent, I think I I would I would get a lot of I get a lot of happiness in seeing my daughter succeed and and and sometimes that’s enough to but.

00:39:48

Jack

Like you said, I think.

00:39:52

Jack

Maybe you know, uh, taking that trip or doing that thing that you really, really want to do.

00:40:00

Jack

Is doesn’t make you a selfish person either you know.

00:40:04

Xochitl

Yeah, it’s the situation where it’s like.

00:40:10

Xochitl

It’s your children and grandchildren will be so much that much happier to see you also do things for yourself.

00:40:19

Jack

There you go. That’s right. That’s right. And that’s the one that’s maybe where they can’t quite get to in their minds. It’s like they’re, you know, they’re going to think that I’m being selfish. And it’s like, no, no, no, we we want you to be happy too.

00:40:20

발표자

Sorry things for you.

00:40:36

Jack

And so yeah, I think that.

00:40:40

Jack

Those are some good, good takeaways. Actually. I’m. I’m glad we had this conversation because it actually helped me process some of my own.

00:40:48

Jack

Kind of thinking and ideas around grief.

00:40:53

Jack

Yeah, it’s. It’s too bad you know that we that that you experienced that so recently and.

00:41:01

Jack

Yeah, I’m just. I’m really sorry for your loss.

00:41:04

Jack

UM.

00:41:05

Xochitl

I appreciate it.

00:41:06

Jack

But, but I’m glad we had this conversation was really, really helpful.

00:41:10

Xochitl

Yeah, me too. Alright, listener as well. If you have ever had a loved one pass away, you’re going to grief yourself. You know what it’s like. Or if you you’re lucky and you don’t know what that’s like yet and you know, let us know. And our WhatsApp group leave a comment down below at AZ englishpodcast.com or shoot us an e-mail at AZ.

00:41:31

Xochitl

Podcast@gmail.com we would love to hear about how grief is in your culture, what grief is like in your country, what the funeral process is like. All of those things I really like to hear about all you guys, different traditions in your home countries. So yeah, shoot us a line, as we say in the US and.

00:41:50

Xochitl

See you guys next.

00:41:51

Xochitl

OK. Bye bye.

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Transcript:

00:00:03

Xochitl

Jack, you kind of had a scary experience, not kind of. You definitely had a scary experience this week. Do you want?

00:00:10

Xochitl

To tell our viewers about it.

00:00:12

Jack

Yeah, I would, I.

00:00:13

Jack

Would love to to share this. Some of our listeners out there who are students in our world English.

00:00:22

Jack

Google meets class.

00:00:24

Jack

I know that I’ve I have been absent lately. The last week or so, and about a week ago, my father had a a major heart attack which was terrifying, you know, for our family and when the.

00:00:45

Jack

The doctors did tests and everything they found that basically.

00:00:50

Jack

All the arteries and artery is like it’s like a tube that carries blood.

00:00:55

Xochitl

Again, laser vein, right a major vein.

00:00:57

Jack

Right. Because your heart pumps.

00:00:59

Jack

Blood to the rest of your.

00:01:01

Jack

Body and it and blood feeds into the heart and then it pumps out and.

00:01:09

Jack

His his arteries were all blocked like they were up. Some of them were 99% blocked, which is, I mean, you’re he. He was not getting enough blood. Umm.

00:01:23

Jack

And uh. And so he ended up having.

00:01:26

Jack

A heart attack.

00:01:27

Jack

And you know, it’s the life when when you lived the life that social and I have lived like, where you work overseas.

00:01:40

Jack

You’re so far away from home and it’s very difficult to receive news that your your family member is is really sick or having a very serious medical emergency.

00:01:54

Jack

And so it was really. Here’s an English expression, touch and go and touch and go means it was very delicate. Like he was very close.

00:02:07

Jack

To to death.

00:02:09

Jack

And luckily my my brother and his his wife were visiting my parents and they both work in the medical profession.

00:02:20

Jack

Motion and my brother noticed the symptoms in my father and and and brought him into the hospital, and my dad has not left the hospital since that time and he actually went and had a a, a quadruple bypass and quadruples.

00:02:41

Jack

It just means 4 quad means 4.

00:02:44

Jack

UM triple bypass means 3 double bypass means two and bypass means one and so he had a A4 bypasses quadruple bypass surgery where they connect arteries. They basically go around.

00:03:04

Jack

The bad part of the artery? The the tube that carries blood into the heart and out of the heart. And they, you know, created new tubes that were clear.

00:03:17

Jack

And clean and they take those tubes from other parts of your body, like from your leg. Or maybe your arm. I’m not sure. And and they harvest them. They they put them, they sew them into.

00:03:37

Jack

Into the heart and he he had that surgery and I just talked to him before the podcast maybe 10 minutes ago.

00:03:46

Jack

No, and he’s out of surgery and he’s doing really, really well. And so it was one of those, like, just terrifying moments where.

00:03:58

Jack

You know, you you.

00:04:01

Jack

You do that kind of like thinking in your head like is.

00:04:05

Jack

Is that the last time I’m gonna?

00:04:08

Jack

Talk to my dad, you know, like, is this is this it like and and and you know, before he went into surgery.

00:04:16

Jack

And so for those 24 hours while he was, you know, in surgery and and coming out of the surgery.

00:04:23

Jack

It was, you know, I was trying to distract myself by listening to podcasts or, you know, talking with my wife and stuff like that. But luckily, everything went really, really well. And so it looks like he’s going to make a full recovery.

00:04:43

Jack

And you know, and for any of our our listeners out there or anyone and I know that you recently experienced a loss in your family. I’ve experienced a a pretty significant loss a couple of years ago and it’s it’s just really scary and painful.

00:05:04

Jack

UM, all the uh. Here’s another expression.

00:05:08

Jack

In English, the woulda coulda should uh.

00:05:11

Jack

Moments. You know, I would have said something I could have said something. And so my big take away, the lesson I learned from this is, you know, hug your loved ones a little bit harder today, you know, because you we just don’t know the future.

00:05:32

Jack

We we do do not know the.

00:05:34

Jack

Future and and and all the little petty grievances that we have with with our our relatives or our friends are so insignificant in the grand scheme of things, you know we.

00:05:55

Jack

You know, we we hold on to.

00:05:56

Jack

Those those things that we.

00:05:58

Jack

We shouldn’t be holding on to and you have to let those go and just just squeeze your loved ones tightly and tell them that you love them because you just never know when when you’re, when they’re going to be gone and and sometimes it.

00:06:19

Jack

It takes a wake up call like almost losing a a parent or a friend or a sibling.

00:06:27

Jack

Before you you realize that, and once they’re gone, it’s it’s too late, you know, to to do that. And so I feel like I got a second chance to really, you know, just say to my father, dad, I love you. You’re you’re amazing and.

00:06:46

Jack

And I feel so lucky and so blessed that I got that opportunity because it could have really gone the other way very easily.

00:06:55

Jack

And uh, you know, those are the the important things in life is family and and and friends and and loved ones that that’s what really matters. So yeah that was the the harrowing experience that that we’ve been dealing with in my family here for.

00:07:14

Jack

The last week or so.

00:07:17

Xochitl

That’s terrible, Jack. I’m really sorry you’ve been dealing.

00:07:20

Xochitl

With all of that.

00:07:21

Jack

Well, thanks. Yeah. Yeah, I I, I I know we’re we don’t need to to, you know, keep talking about this but it kind of brought you you mentioned the topic of like family emergencies and things like that and.

00:07:40

Jack

What about you?

00:07:40

Jack

Have you experienced any like family emergencies that you don’t mind sharing with our our podcast listeners?

00:07:48

Xochitl

Yeah, for sure. I mean, I guess the first one would be when my grandfather passed away, I guess that was in October now.

00:07:58

Xochitl

Or the IT was either the end of September or the beginning of October. It’s fuzzy in my mind at this point, but.

00:08:07

Xochitl

It feels like.

00:08:08

Xochitl

So long and go.

00:08:09

Xochitl

Now, because how of how the brain like process is lost?

00:08:15

Xochitl

It just feels both so recent and so far at the same time, and and that was.

00:08:21

Jack

Right, right.

00:08:23

Xochitl

Just a big thing because I didn’t. I couldn’t even fly back to see him in time, really.

00:08:33

Xochitl

That was a big deal. And then recently my grandmother this week as well on Monday.

00:08:41

Xochitl

Wasn’t able to get out.

00:08:42

Xochitl

Of bed she wasn’t able to stand.

00:08:44

Xochitl

Up on her legs.

00:08:46

Xochitl

And we did call. I eventually convinced them to call the ambulance, which had to come and strap him to a chair because of the driveways, like on a slope. And it’s very icy because of the Iowa weather.

00:09:00

Xochitl

And when they got her into the ambulance, they took her to the hospital and they did some imaging and some tests I found out she has pneumonia, bacterial pneumonia in her lungs. Pneumonia is an infection of the lungs. For those of you who don’t know.

00:09:14

Xochitl

And so.

00:09:17

Xochitl

That was kind of a big deal, but thankfully she’s OK and they did tell us that at the hospital, you know, she was good to come home that night around 1:00 or 2:00 AM.

00:09:30

Xochitl

They gave her an antibiotic and she’s doing OK.

00:09:34

Xochitl

UM, but it certainly was scary in the moment. She was very confused. I didn’t understand. It was why I wanted.

00:09:41

Xochitl

To call the.

00:09:41

Xochitl

Ambulance, she’s she.

00:09:43

Xochitl

Had a lot of like confusion and she seemed like lost.

00:09:48

Xochitl

And I thought it was weird. And when they came, they thought, you know, it might be pneumonia or some kind of infection. I didn’t understand what the confusion was about, but once it got to her to the hospital, they had to put her on.

00:09:59

Xochitl

Oxygen, because her oxygen was very low.

00:10:02

Xochitl

And of course that makes sense as to.

00:10:04

Xochitl

How it affected her?

00:10:06

Xochitl

Her brain. Right. She wasn’t getting that oxygen supply that she needed, which is why she was pretty confused.

00:10:14

Jack

Exactly. Yep.

00:10:16

Xochitl

Yeah, it it it. It was a scary experience and like Jack said, it makes you think, OK, you should enjoy.

00:10:24

Xochitl

Appreciate and value the time you have with people because you never know when the last conversation will be, when your last day together is going to be.

00:10:32

Xochitl

When your last memory together is going to be and I don’t think you’ll ever regret.

00:10:37

Xochitl

Spending that time together at the end.

00:10:39

발표자

Of it.

00:10:44

Xochitl

Yeah. And another big deal for me, I think is.

00:10:50

Xochitl

It’s important to.

00:10:52

Xochitl

See the issues are family are dealing with in their older age as a full warning.

00:10:59

Xochitl

You it’s not just about.

00:11:01

Xochitl

How long your life is, but it’s about the quality of life that you experience, and at the end of your years, like into your 70s, eighties, 90s. If you make it that far, you want to live as comfortably as you can.

00:11:17

Xochitl

And and that definitely means taking care of your body now. So like your diet, maybe your your health in general keeping on top of any pre-existing conditions or any genetic conditions. You know that your family had, you know, keep screening for those things always prioritize your health get enough sleep.

00:11:38

Xochitl

Eat healthy, sleep enough, drink enough water, do regular exercise and keep your body in good condition. Don’t wear it out, you know.

00:11:47

Xochitl

Because it.

00:11:48

Xochitl

It works very hard every day and it’s going to have to last you.

00:11:53

Xochitl

Probably 80 years at this point, you know, because of life expectancy altogether when a new baby is born is probably going to live into its 70s or 80s, so.

00:12:03

Xochitl

Yeah, it’s important to take care of your body.

00:12:06

Jack

Yeah, we have a. This is another little idiom. Uh, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

00:12:20

Jack

And what that means is just a little bit of a little bit of prevention early on like taking care of like what you said, your health, watching your diet, getting some exercise, getting good sleep. Sleep is really, really important.

00:12:40

Jack

Uh, I think it’s the one that most people ignore.

00:12:46

Jack

You know and and if you do those things when you’re young and you develop those good habits, then as you get older, your quality of life will remain much higher because.

00:13:00

Jack

I don’t how many you know, do you?

00:13:02

Jack

Do people want to live to be 90?

00:13:05

Jack

But the last 30 years of their lives, they’re basically stuck in a chair.

00:13:11

Jack

You know unable to move.

00:13:15

Jack

I do you do you have any? Like, I have some health issues and I don’t mind sharing with the with the, with the listeners out there. A couple of my major health issues. One of them is that I have a genetic.

00:13:35

Jack

High genetically high cholesterol? It’s not. It’s not really anything that I can control with diet. My cholesterol is just always off the charts. And so I started visiting a cardiologist a couple years ago and a car. A cardiologist is a.

00:13:54

Jack

Is a heart doctor, a heart specialist and he put me on some medicine. They’re called statins, and a statin is a medicine that lowers your cholesterol.

00:14:06

Jack

And that was something I I’m really glad I did that because I tried to manage it through my weight and I tried to manage it through my exercise and through my diet, and I was just never able to get my cholesterol under control. And as you can see, because my father just.

00:14:26

Jack

Had a heart attack.

00:14:28

Jack

Is that?

00:14:29

Jack

In my family, we we genetically we’re we have a a predisposition which means a high likelihood of of having some kind of heart problems later in life. And I thought if I can just get this under control now in my 40s.

00:14:50

Jack

Maybe I can avoid the same problems that my father just experienced and my grandfather experienced and my uncle and my cousin experienced. I mean, I it’s all over my family. I it’s it’s lots of heart problems on my family, not so much cancer.

00:15:10

Jack

But it feels like it’s either one or the other in a family, right? It’s like.

00:15:16

Jack

Hearts are hearts great, but cancer, you know, is is common or not so much cancer, but a lot of heart problems. It seems like you can never avoid one of them one or the other.

00:15:20

발표자

Right.

00:15:32

Jack

UM and the other thing that really is, is, uh, too late for me in some ways is that I have really serious back issues. So I’ve had two back surgeries already.

00:15:47

Jack

And I’ve it’s it’s something that really makes it difficult for me to exercise because I was an athlete in in high school and college. I played college basketball. I was in very good shape. You know, as an athlete.

00:16:06

Jack

And one of the things that is kind of common for athletes is once they stop playing competitively, they tend to.

00:16:16

Jack

Gain weight and not remain healthy because there’s no reason to exercise because you’re not playing anymore games and so one of the the things that happened to me is I just got really, you know, kind of lazy and ate what I wanted to eat. But I wasn’t exercising.

00:16:37

Jack

Like I like I was when I was in college and.

00:16:42

Jack

And so for me it’s it’s a little difficult because I can’t run anymore my my spine is just too is too weak. I can’t. I can’t do long distance running, so I’ve been doing cycling lately and.

00:17:01

Jack

And and it’s just it’s it’s a a kind of nagging issue and and I and I it’s it’s uh, it’s something I wish I I wish I had.

00:17:11

Jack

Taken care of my back.

00:17:14

Jack

UMA lot better. When I was younger because now I’m kind of paying the price for not taking care of it 20 years ago.

00:17:26

Jack

Uhm and uh and.

00:17:28

Jack

So maybe that’s.

00:17:29

Jack

I can give you kind of uh, uh. I could be kind of a a cautionary tale to people who are younger, like your age that take care of your back. Take care of your knees. You know, those are really important if you want to stay healthy because.

00:17:46

Jack

And in order to exercise you need you need to have.

00:17:50

Jack

A. A healthy spine and you need to have healthy knees and I’ve I’ve unfortunately had knee surgery, several back surgeries. I’m I’m just a kind of broken down machine.

00:18:10

Jack

It’s. Uh, yeah. So I I agree with you 100% what you’re talking about is the prevention is is the cure many times.

00:18:21

발표자

Right.

00:18:26

Xochitl

Yeah, I I have.

00:18:28

Xochitl

Some long term health issues as well that I’m trying to to get taken care of here in my 20s so that through my 30s and 40s I can make sure my body.

00:18:39

Xochitl

Is strong enough that it won’t keep deteriorating, I guess.

00:18:43

Jack

Right.

00:18:44

Jack

Right.

00:18:46

Jack

Yeah. So I thought that we could transition to something that that is I, I guess the topic today is medical emergencies and we’ve we’ve talked about that a little.

00:18:58

Jack

But and we there’s a there was a question from one of our our students in, in our WhatsApp group and they were just kind of wondering like what is the the process for like when like when when people go to the hospital?

00:19:19

Jack

In America.

00:19:22

Jack

And what is the uh like? They’re asking. UM, what? What is the culture like when visiting a relative in the hospital? And I think it’s kind of interesting because I I learned a few things about that in Korea.

00:19:38

Jack

And that it it’s different than in America. And I’m I’m wondering if if you have the same experience or?

00:19:48

Jack

What the experience might be like in Mexico as well, because I know that you also have lived there for long periods of time. And so in Korea.

00:19:59

Jack

If your family member has a surgery.

00:20:03

Jack

The family is expected to do a lot of the.

00:20:07

Jack

Kind of caretaking duties know. Obviously, the family is not giving, administering any shots or, you know, drugs or anything like that. They’re not doing medical procedures, but if you know, if your family members in the hospital, there’s always another family member in the room.

00:20:28

Jack

To you know, give you a pillow.

00:20:32

Jack

Help you eat, make you comfortable and nurses are much more kind of distanced.

00:20:44

Jack

From the patient, they’re not. They’re not really like sitting there, talking to you and taking care of you. They’re they’re much more interested in the kind of technical things like giving shots and checking your vital signs and things like that.

00:21:02

Jack

And that’s kind of different than the American system. The American system is the nurses do a lot more.

00:21:09

Jack

I’ve found I’ve found, like their nurses are, you know they’ll they’ll, uh, bring your food. They’ll help you eat it. They’ll take the tray away. They will.

00:21:23

Jack

They’ll, you know, give you another pillow if you need a pillow, they’ll ask you if you’re comfortable. They’ll they’ll bring you a blanket if you’re cold. Or take your blanket off if you’re too hot. Those kinds of things. And that was a really kind of shocking difference. I noticed. And the reason I noticed that is because, like I said, I have had several.

00:21:43

Jack

Back surgeries and both of them were in Korea and the first time that I had back surgery in Korea.

00:21:51

Jack

I was I I I was here alone. You know, I wasn’t married. And so I was just all alone in this room. And the nurse would come in really quickly, check my IV bag or whatever. And then she would leave. And.

00:22:08

Jack

But my food was just sitting on another table.

00:22:13

Jack

Kind of far away from my bed and.

00:22:18

Jack

No one was there to.

00:22:20

Jack

I couldn’t reach it.

00:22:22

Jack

Like it was just they just set it down on the table and walked out.

00:22:27

Jack

And I’m like.

00:22:27

Xochitl

Right. Reach for you.

00:22:28

Jack

How? How am I supposed to? How am I?

00:22:30

Jack

Supposed to eat that? I can’t even I can’t move.

00:22:33

Jack

And I ended up having to grab this like pole.

00:22:38

Jack

And I had to reach the pole and hook the table and pull the table towards my my bed so that I could reach the the food and it was just really it was. It was really strange because it was.

00:22:58

Jack

They basically expected me to have someone there to take care of me.

00:23:03

Jack

But I didn’t have anyone in the country.

00:23:06

Jack

To take care of me.

00:23:07

Jack

So I was kind of left, you know, without missing this this really important piece of of of, of the, of the of the process of, of recovering. And I don’t know how. What would you like would you say in America nurses are?

00:23:27

Jack

More hands on in in that regard.

00:23:31

Xochitl

Yeah, I feel like the nurses are kind of the backbone of the medical industry in America, they.

00:23:40

Xochitl

Do a lot of the heavy lifting, like a lot of times, you’ll see the doctor for like 5 minutes or 10 minutes, maybe. Probably less, more, more like 5 minutes and the nurse will do everything. They’ll take your blood work, they’ll swab you.

00:23:45

Jack

Right.

00:23:56

Xochitl

They will ask you, do you know questions or fill fill out your history. They get your background and your story. If you’re bedridden like you’re old, or you just had a surgery, they’ll like change out your bedpan or they’ll walk you to the bathroom. They’ll get your food for you. Like Jack said, they’ll administer your medications.

00:24:15

Xochitl

For you, uh, even if it’s just.

00:24:18

Xochitl

A pill? They’ll bring it to you.

00:24:19

Xochitl

With water or.

00:24:20

Xochitl

Whatever they’ll like. Refill your Sprite. I’ve been hospitalized a few different times, both in the.

00:24:25

Xochitl

US and in Mexico.

00:24:27

Xochitl

Just this year I was probably hospitalized like 4.

00:24:29

Xochitl

Or five times.

00:24:30

Xochitl

Maybe. Yeah. And they.

00:24:37

Xochitl

Here in the US, like they’ll they’ll like order.

00:24:39

Xochitl

Food for you. Bring it to you. Give.

00:24:41

Xochitl

You a Sprite, put.

00:24:43

Xochitl

Like SpongeBob on for you on the TV, it feels like being a.

00:24:45

Xochitl

Little kid again. Kind of.

00:24:46

Jack

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:24:48

Xochitl

And it’s kind of nice because all.

00:24:51

Xochitl

You have to do is focus.

00:24:52

Xochitl

About getting better, you don’t really have.

00:24:53

Xochitl

To worry about anything.

00:24:56

Xochitl

And as Jack and I have talked about before in the US.

00:25:00

Xochitl

Like, if you’re like the process of it is basically like if you’re sick with a cold or something, you would go to a clinic. But if your symptoms are more severe, you would go to urgent care.

00:25:13

Xochitl

And if your symptoms are like more severe than that, like either life threatening or you can’t really take care of yourself, or it could lead to serious complications and you need like emergency testing or imaging or whatever, then you would go to the.

00:25:28

Xochitl

ER or like?

00:25:29

Xochitl

Emergency room and then you may be hospitalized for a couple of days, depending what your situation is.

00:25:35

Xochitl

And what they see your condition as and like Jack and I have talked about before, it’s kind of like a more of a luxury experience. You kind of get your own room.

00:25:46

Jack

Right.

00:25:50

Xochitl

You can like order food off a menu now. Just last time I was.

00:25:52

Jack

Ohh really?

00:25:55

Xochitl

Yeah, there’s an.

00:25:55

Jack

OK.

00:25:57

Xochitl

I was hospitalized for a couple days. Uh, when was it, Jack? In December. Right. Because I remember. I was new podcast. I talk about for like two or three days in December and they give you like a menu and you tell the nurse what you want and they order for you and they bring it to you and they give you, like, a drink. Like, you can ask for Sprite or apple juice.

00:26:18

Xochitl

Or whatever you want.

00:26:21

Xochitl

UM and I was just kind of sitting in there. She she asked me if I wanted to turn on the TV. She put SpongeBob on.

00:26:32

Xochitl

And I was just watching SpongeBob in there with like a Sprite and my dinner. And it was just kind of funny because it was basically like being a kid. And you’re kind of being waited on hand and foot.

00:26:46

Xochitl

By the nurse.

00:26:48

Xochitl

Doctors and the team, the.

00:26:50

Xochitl

Care team are coming in and out and like.

00:26:52

Xochitl

Asking questions and maybe they’re like phlebotomist or whoever is taking your blood. That’s the person.

00:26:56

Xochitl

That like, puts a needle in your arm into your vein and takes your blood out so phlebotomist and then, as like a specialist, might come in and get an EKG on you, which is like a they put little stickers on you where they, like, read.

00:27:09

Xochitl

Your heart and your.

00:27:11

Xochitl

UM, basically your heart rate, and make sure there’s no like heart murmurs or like issues with your heart.

00:27:18

Xochitl

And yeah, and so nurses do everything. And in Mexico, I would say that’s also different, Jack.

00:27:25

Xochitl

The When I went to the public hospital, it’s completely free. I had to go twice.

00:27:31

Xochitl

100% free like in the US, it was free for me, but only because I have Medicaid, which is National Health insurance. But if.

00:27:39

Xochitl

I were if.

00:27:40

Xochitl

I didn’t have Medicaid.

00:27:41

Xochitl

It would have been thousands and thousands of dollars.

00:27:44

Xochitl

Like probably 10s.

00:27:45

Xochitl

Of thousands of dollars to have been there like a couple of nights.

00:27:50

Xochitl

In Mexico, I have no health insurance, but.

00:27:55

Xochitl

It’s absolutely free.

00:27:57

Xochitl

UM, but it’s.

00:27:58

Xochitl

Really short staffed.

00:28:01

Xochitl

They have a ton of students in there because there’s not like enough doctors or anything, so there’s like students trying to take your blood and doing a really terrible job. There’s like one nurse running around trying to take care of everyone. There’s no rooms. You’re all just sitting out in a.

00:28:15

Xochitl

Hallway and these beds?

00:28:17

Jack

Right.

00:28:20

Xochitl

You’re not super allowed to have visitors like they’re your visitors or people who could visit you.

00:28:25

Xochitl

Have to sit in the waiting room, which are just these steel chairs, but they if they like, if the short staff and it’s like night time and stuff, they’ll let like one person through like the lady who was in front of me, like on her little hospital bed. She was using a bed pan, so they let her mom through so she could.

00:28:46

Xochitl

Help with certain stuff so.

00:28:47

Xochitl

She was like the one emptying out her bedpan, or.

00:28:49

Xochitl

Like doing certain things. So I would agree like the.

00:28:52

Xochitl

Family is much more.

00:28:53

Xochitl

Involved and.

00:28:54

Xochitl

The hospital staff was very irritated with me because.

00:28:57

Xochitl

I didn’t have.

00:28:57

Xochitl

Anyone there with me to do certain things like?

00:29:02

Xochitl

UM, get like a CD.

00:29:04

Xochitl

For medical imaging or like.

00:29:10

Xochitl

Go to the like.

00:29:12

Xochitl

Withdraw blood. I didn’t like. Go to the lab because it was a weekend and they’re they’re their lab inside the hospital isn’t open on the weekend, so.

00:29:19

Xochitl

They needed like.

00:29:20

Xochitl

Someone to be there and they also don’t want to release you from the hospital unless you have someone.

00:29:25

Xochitl

There to pick you up.

00:29:26

Jack

Right.

00:29:27

Xochitl

And and I think all these things come from like collectivist culture, where there’s strong family ties, right. So it’s like your family, you live close to your family, probably. And your family will be there for you and you’ll be there for your family. But in the US, a lot of people will leave for college, move away for work. It’s a huge country.

00:29:47

Xochitl

A lot of people’s families.

00:29:48

Xochitl

Can’t drive 10 hours or fly five hours or.

00:29:51

Xochitl

Whatever out to.

00:29:51

Xochitl

Where they are, and so we’re very lucky. Like in your brother’s case.

00:29:53

Jack

Right.

00:29:56

Xochitl

Like you said, he was visiting.

00:29:57

Jack

Right.

00:29:59

Xochitl

Because it’s such a huge country and people live kind of in Siller, like, isolated from their families, a lot of the times and they live, they move far away from their families.

00:30:09

Xochitl

For the reasons I mentioned, the hospital doesn’t really expect.

00:30:15

Xochitl

Your family to do any of that. In fact, they would probably be irritated if your family was in there trying.

00:30:21

Xochitl

To take on.

00:30:21

Xochitl

Any of these tasks?

00:30:24

Xochitl

Because they see it as like a medical professional’s job and not the job of your family, right?

00:30:33

Jack

Well, I think families get in the way sometimes, too many questions. There’s too many, too many people in the room. You know, it’s kind of like, get out, get out of the.

00:30:36

Xochitl

Yeah, they do.

00:30:41

Jack

Way, let us do our job.

00:30:44

Xochitl

Right. Yeah, it’s pretty bad. What about the culture of visiting someone in the hospital, Jack, what would?

00:30:50

Xochitl

You say that’s like.

00:30:52

Jack

Yeah. So that one’s a little different. Like what we’re describing is kind of the long term care part of the hospital. But if you just receive a visitor, there are in America, there are visiting hours. And so, you know, people can come in and it’s usually during a time when.

00:31:13

Jack

The nurses are not performing some kind of.

00:31:18

Jack

Some kind of job, you know, if they’re, if they have to take blood or they have to do it, run a test or something, then they don’t want any visitors in there. Visiting hours are only during the daytime. Now if you’re a family member, they’ll give you an exemption so they’ll they’ll bring it a a kind of sleeping chair if.

00:31:37

Jack

But you know for like for example, my mother wanted if she wanted to stay with my father overnight there, she could have slept there.

00:31:47

Jack

They she only lives 5 minutes away, so they just decided to go home and and sleep and then come back to the hospital. But but when it comes to just like visiting someone in the hospital, you you know you you you check in you you say who you want.

00:32:08

Jack

To to visit, they make sure that you are that that the person who is in the hospital, who’s sick, wants to see you. You know they’re not gonna let anyone in. That makes the patient uncomfortable or feel more stress.

00:32:26

Jack

And and uh. And then you can come in and you can. You can spend a short amount of time, you know, just, you know, giving what we call in English, we say moral support, you know, just cheering up, lifting the spirits of the patient, the person who is sick.

00:32:45

Jack

But yeah, it I think they’re they’re very strict about visiting hours and the amount of time that people are able to, to, to see the, the, their, their friend who is in the hospital because they have.

00:33:01

Jack

A job to.

00:33:01

Jack

Do and they don’t.

00:33:03

Jack

Want any of that visiting to get in the way of what they need to do to make this person healthy? Because the number one objective is to get this person.

00:33:15

Jack

Stable and in the recovery process and you know, and so oftentimes nurses get a bad reputation for being kind of mean.

00:33:27

Jack

You know what I mean? Like, OK, now you get outta here. It’s you’re done. You know, it’s like leave. Leave him alone. Let let him. Let him sleep. Let her sleep. And so it’s it’s kind you get kind of. They get a little bit of a bad reputation for that, but I think it’s just because they need to be forceful.

00:33:46

Jack

Otherwise, family members and and friends will just kind of be hanging out there in the house.

00:33:52

Jack

People, and they don’t want a lot of people hanging out in the hospital. Number one, they can bring in illnesses and you know, diseases and stuff like that. So if if one of those visitors is sick, that could hurt the the patient. It could also hurt other people who are in the hospital and a lot of.

00:34:12

Jack

You don’t when you’re in the hospital.

00:34:14

Jack

And you’re let’s say.

00:34:17

Jack

In a not in a room, but like.

00:34:20

Jack

You know how to.

00:34:21

Jack

Have, like the curtains, a kind of a curtain room.

00:34:25

Xochitl

Right. It’s like you’re in. You’re all in the same room, but you’re separated.

00:34:28

Xochitl

By privacy curtain.

00:34:29

Jack

Privacy curtains. That’s what I was looking for. And.

00:34:34

Jack

You don’t want you you’ve you’re very.

00:34:36

Jack

Vulnerable. You know, you’re you’re half naked, you know, like you’re wearing a just a a hospital gown.

00:34:44

Jack

You, you, you. You know you don’t, you don’t you you don’t present well, you your you look sick. Your hair is a mess. You’re not wearing makeup or whatever and.

00:34:58

Jack

Those people, they.

00:34:59

Jack

Don’t want to be seen by a lot of.

00:35:04

Jack

Other strangers you know, because you know, I’m just thinking like, especially when like, kids come to the hospital, they’re curious you.

00:35:12

Jack

Know they want to look around and.

00:35:15

Jack

And see, you know, who are these other people and what’s wrong with them? And that makes the patients uncomfortable. So I I think the reason there is a very strict rules about who can come in and for how long they can stay is not is, it’s not about punishing the the.

00:35:34

Jack

Patient or the visitors, it’s about making the other patients comfortable as well. And so I I kind of like the American system. I think it’s because like you, you.

00:35:45

Jack

Know in your situation.

00:35:47

Jack

You didn’t. You didn’t have any immediate family there with you.

00:35:50

Jack

At that time, I didn’t.

00:35:53

Jack

There should be some kind of.

00:35:56

Jack

Protocol for those situations, it shouldn’t just be like, well, I guess that’s, you know that that sucks for you. There’s, you know, sorry you don’t have anyone here to help you. It’s like, you know, it’s like, what am I supposed to do? You know, I I I thought it was just a very bizarre.

00:36:09

Xochitl

Right.

00:36:16

Jack

Situation I I was in a hospital. It was so funny. There was a TV, but there was a it was coin operated so.

00:36:25

Jack

You had to actually get out of bed.

00:36:28

Jack

Go put coins into the TV.

00:36:33

Jack

And then it would turn on and you could buy.

00:36:36

Jack

I think maybe $0.50 would buy you.

00:36:40

Jack

30 minutes of television.

00:36:42

Jack

Something like that and.

00:36:45

Jack

And I didn’t even have anyone to.

00:36:47

Jack

Put the coins.

00:36:47

Jack

In the TV for me, you know, because it was like, you know, not the nurse’s job to do that. So it it was just a very strange experience for me.

00:37:00

Jack

And I I I just was kind of, I didn’t expect it. You know, it’s one of those things when you live in another country.

00:37:08

Jack

UM, you can’t predict everything.

00:37:11

Xochitl

Right.

00:37:13

Jack

And you just always assume that it’s going to be the same as your country.

00:37:18

Xochitl

Ray’s really prepared for those kind of situations.

00:37:22

Jack

Yeah, you just and and it’s the funniest little.

00:37:25

Jack

Situations just like like I said, like the food where they just put the the food on the on the table. That was like far away from my bed. And I’m like, hello is what am I what? How do I eat this?

00:37:39

Jack

And yeah, it was just a very, very strange experience. And I’m not saying it’s a bad experience. I think it’s great that you, that family members are expected to kind of step up and do some of that work because I think nurses are overburdened with with too many things anyway.

00:37:59

Jack

UM, but I do think that like exceptions should be made when people don’t have family members, because there are going to be situations where.

00:38:10

Jack

There you know you have a patient that doesn’t have, maybe they don’t have any family left. Maybe their family is all passed away or they didn’t, never had kids or who knows, it could be a whole host of reasons why there’s you don’t have someone there to help you or there should be like a service where you can hire.

00:38:30

Jack

And like a a helper.

00:38:33

Jack

You know and.

00:38:35

Xochitl

They do have that now. I think that you can get a private nurse now in Korea. I heard that you can.

00:38:40

Xochitl

Pay a private nurse.

00:38:41

Jack

Ohh. OK OK, maybe that would have been the right way for that. That would have been very useful for me. I just didn’t know beforehand. So yeah, just.

00:38:50

발표자

I don’t know.

00:38:51

Xochitl

If it was possible back then, or if it’s just become more of a thing because a lot of people like move away from college now and there’s more foreigners in the country and there’s just like, I guess after years of situations where there was a patient that couldn’t take care of themselves, they changed it a little bit. So you can like hire on.

00:39:08

Xochitl

One recently I think you can hire on a nurse like a private.

00:39:13

Xochitl

Nurse. But you would have.

00:39:15

Xochitl

To pay additional money. And it’s just kind of sucks in a way, because.

00:39:20

Xochitl

UM.

00:39:22

Xochitl

You wouldn’t really have.

00:39:23

Xochitl

To worry about that, I guess like in the US like it’s just included.

00:39:28

Xochitl

And they’re charging you bazooka box.

00:39:30

Xochitl

Another way to say a.

00:39:31

Jack

Yeah, the money you’re paying in America, you deserve a a whole private staff, a Butler, a maid.

00:39:31

Xochitl

Lot of but like.

00:39:40

Xochitl

And the nurse that’s working as a Butler and the made basically. And the medical professional, they’re doing a lot so.

00:39:47

Xochitl

That does make it really hard.

00:39:50

Xochitl

But yeah, I think with in Korea that’s one aspect I thought about getting the surgery I was going to get.

00:39:58

Xochitl

In Korea, because it’s so.

00:40:00

Xochitl

Much cheaper, but then I realized.

00:40:02

Xochitl

Like I’d have to spend money for, like my mom or something to come out because.

00:40:07

Xochitl

And at that point, it’s like I’m not saving that much money because I basically have to pay lodging for my mom, and I’d have to pay a plane ticket for her cause I’d need someone to take care of me because.

00:40:17

Xochitl

The nurse isn’t really.

00:40:18

Xochitl

Going to do it or again, you could hire a private nurse. But again, that’s also adding to your expenses. So that’s just something to consider.

00:40:25

Xochitl

And it’s like if you are going to move to a foreign country, I guess it’s something to look into because it is shocking how different those experiences can be.

00:40:34

Jack

Yeah. And you never know when you’re gonna need, you know, I mean, I I had a a. Like I said I I had a back surgery at that time and it was a a ruptured disc in my spine and yeah. So I was in the hospital for several days. And I remember just gritting my teeth.

00:40:55

Jack

And uh.

00:40:57

Jack

Trying to get out of there as fast as I could. Like I went home after.

00:41:02

Jack

Way too fast. You know, I was just like, OK, if if no one’s gonna help me, I can do. I can do.

00:41:09

Jack

This at home. Then you know it’ll be easier. And so I actually just.

00:41:18

Jack

It’s made me kind of pretended like I was doing better than I than I was with the doctor. You know, I was up.

00:41:25

Jack

Walking around and.

00:41:27

Jack

And how do?

00:41:28

Jack

You feel ohh feel.

00:41:29

Jack

Great. You know, but I didn’t.

00:41:33

Xochitl

To be at home.

00:41:34

Jack

I just wanted to get out of there because I was like, you know what, like, if, if if I’m going to do it all on my own.

00:41:40

Jack

Anyway, might as well be in my own apartment like there really is no reason for me to to, to be in this hospital. And so that was the one thing that kind of turned me off to it. The thing that I did like was they’re very competent. They’re very nice. It wasn’t, you know, it wasn’t a bad experience. It was just.

00:42:00

Jack

It was one of those culture shock moments and and yeah there it’s it’s very interesting. Like I just what the expectations are from country to country and so you know I’d really like love to hear from our listeners out there like what is it like in your country?

00:42:04

Xochitl

Right.

00:42:19

Jack

Because, you know, do they do the nurses like, what are the what’s what are what are the job duties of of a nurse in other countries? Because I I bet it’s some of them are similar to Korea and some are probably similar to the United States.

00:42:39

Xochitl

Right. It’s like.

00:42:39

Jack

Yeah, I’d be really interested.

00:42:41

Xochitl

Our nurses. Yeah. I want to hear from you listeners, our nurses, you know, expected to take on duties like the US. Or is there other hospital staff that takes the place of a nurse or patients kind of left to fend for their own if they don’t have any family? Like, does family have responsibilities? What’s the protocol for?

00:43:01

Xochitl

Visiting sick family. Yeah, we would really like to hear from you guys, so make sure to leave a comment down below at A-Z. Inversepodcast.com shoot us an e-mail at AZ englishpodcast@gmail.com.

00:43:13

Xochitl

And join our WhatsApp only chat groups to join the conversation and let Jack and I.

00:43:17

Xochitl

Know what’s it?

00:43:17

Xochitl

Like in your country. See you guys.

00:43:19

Xochitl

Next time, bye bye.

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Transcript:

00:00:00

Xochitl

You are listening to the Jack and Chill podcast.

00:00:14

Jack

All right. So so. So tell me about your, uh, your travel page, your social media.

00:00:20

Jack

Travel page.

00:00:21

Xochitl

Like the struggle is so real with trying to grow social media and you know you and I have experienced this before because we’re trying to grow A-Z English podcast. And the complication is really cut to grow, especially for like niches like.

00:00:37

Xochitl

Like language, learning, podcasts, or travel pages or whatever, because there’s a lot of quality content and bizarre content and like attention grabbing content that’s competing with your content and everyone’s attention span has become so short. Because I’m guilty of this too. Like, I’ll see a real or like a video or a post.

00:00:59

Xochitl

On my Instagram and I’ll like it, but I won’t finish watching it. I’ll just, like, give it a like or save it.

00:01:04

Xochitl

For later, which I never go back to and.

00:01:07

Xochitl

And just keep.

00:01:08

Xochitl

Like I won’t sit there and watch.

00:01:09

Xochitl

A 5 second video.

00:01:12

Xochitl

For three seconds and and that’s how they measure it. To promote your videos. How many people? How many? 3 second views did you get? At least in Instagram and Facebook?

00:01:23

Xochitl

That’s how they promote your content is based on the amount of three second views you’re getting, because if you’re able to capture some of the attention for three seconds, that means that your real is classified as interesting enough to keep showing it to more people. That’s the metric. Now is 3 seconds of your time.

00:01:40

Jack

Goodness, that’s good.

00:01:41

Jack

Grief. I know exactly you’re talking about. It’s like.

00:01:47

Jack

It it almost takes like you almost have to be delusional, like crazy to to even think that that you can be successful in this space. You know what I mean? It’s it. It takes. Yeah. It takes like a level of like self delusion where you just kind of trick yourself into thinking you’re going to be successful.

00:02:07

Jack

Because it’s so saturated with like.

00:02:12

Jack

Like you said, quality.

00:02:13

Jack

Content and bad quality content you know like.

00:02:17

Jack

It’s it’s a.

00:02:17

Jack

Mix of everything and when you jump in there, you’re just like your one tiny little star in the Galaxy. Like there’s no there’s, you know, and then you just from there, you have to just start building.

00:02:33

Jack

Some sort of fan base, you know, and the only way to do that is by participating in social media, because if you go into these groups and you just spam.

00:02:45

Jack

Them you’ll be. That’s worse than not promoting your podcast at all, you know, like, yeah, I’ll get banned right from the group right away. And everyone will look at me like, oh, that person is just a they’re just a spammer, you know? So what you have to do is you have to get involved in these groups and you have to become like a member.

00:02:51

Xochitl

Wait, you’re good, ban.

00:03:06

Jack

And that it takes a lot of time right? To like answer, reply to emails, reply to social media posts and Facebook posts and stuff like that. And then after you do that for.

00:03:18

Jack

Like a month. If somebody asks you like, hey, by the way, do you know a good podcast to to learn English? And then you could say ohh yeah, I know a good podcast. It’s called the A-Z English podcast and you could then finally drop it, but you have to.

00:03:33

Jack

Do it in that.

00:03:33

Jack

Very subtle kind of way, but all that work and all those hours of like.

00:03:39

Jack

Time I spent, you know, chatting with with people in the groups just to become a member and accept it into the group so that I could, you know, and it’s it’s really like that’s the stuff that’s the hard part making the podcast is easy. You.

00:03:54

Jack

Know you just.

00:03:56

Jack

Get together and record an episode. It’s fun. Editing is great. Adding the music and that sort of stuff. It seems like that would be the hard part, but that is the absolute easiest part of the process. The hardest part is.

00:04:11

Jack

Building a community.

00:04:12

Jack

So I like how did you.

00:04:14

Jack

Build your community in in your.

00:04:16

Jack

For your Facebook Travel travel blog.

00:04:19

Xochitl

I just see like I haven’t really.

00:04:22

Xochitl

Done any of the stuff you’ve done, like go in local chats or anything like that, or post about it. I think honestly, I think one of the things where we fell short both in the 8 is the English.

00:04:32

Xochitl

Podcast you do a.

00:04:33

Xochitl

Lot of work yourself like marketing.

00:04:35

Xochitl

The page but I.

00:04:36

Xochitl

Just think we’re not shameless enough, Jack. Like, we don’t have that totally shameless promotional attitude.

00:04:41

Xochitl

That a lot of people.

00:04:43

Xochitl

A lot of social media influencers have.

00:04:45

Xochitl

Like, we’re kind of we’re not.

00:04:47

Xochitl

Shy about our work per se.

00:04:49

Xochitl

But we definitely have like.

00:04:51

Xochitl

A certain level of decorum that just does not exist in this new level of competitive marketing age.

00:04:58

Xochitl

Like people do, disband the chats and hope that someone clicks on their content and hopes that someone notices their content and they have no decorum about it.

00:05:08

Jack

No shame, no humility. You’re just like.

00:05:12

Xochitl

Yeah, they don’t care.

00:05:13

Xochitl

How they come off at all, they just want the.

00:05:15

Xochitl

Clicks want the views.

00:05:16

Xochitl

And they kind of follow that old saying like.

00:05:20

Xochitl

What is it? No, there’s no such thing.

00:05:23

Xochitl

As bad publicity.

00:05:24

Jack

Right.

00:05:25

Xochitl

A lot of people really live both of words and and I struggle. Yeah. And so for me, I I have been sharing my, you know, my Facebook page. I did share it on one chat. I’m part of a group called. So I guess I lied. I do do it a little bit. I’m part of a group called Viajeros and.

00:05:43

Xochitl

AKA which is like a travel group for Oaxaca.

00:05:48

Xochitl

And I was part.

00:05:49

Xochitl

Of this community for a long time and.

00:05:51

Xochitl

One day.

00:05:52

Xochitl

The administrator gave people a chance to share their social media, so that was one way that I got a few of these on my Instagram, on my Facebook and another way is through my networking opportunities like I’ve worked in the tourism industry. So of course when we exchange social media information.

00:06:09

Xochitl

I have gotten some followers through there.

00:06:13

Xochitl

And then I do share like with my Facebook friends.

00:06:19

Xochitl

I’ve started to because I.

00:06:23

Xochitl

Used to not. It’s like I used to feel embarrassed about sharing my content to my Facebook friends. But.

00:06:28

Xochitl

Now it’s like that’s a big.

00:06:31

Xochitl

Chunk of people that could watch and share and support your content, you know, and I do notice that the people who are the most shameless or have the least shame.

00:06:42

Jack

You’re the most to have the most success, right?

00:06:45

Xochitl

Having a success. There’s another guy on the viejitos group and.

00:06:48

Xochitl

He just he.

00:06:49

Xochitl

Used to spam basically spam the chat and.

00:06:52

Xochitl

He would like literally.

00:06:55

Xochitl

Information hostage of people. They ask a general question, and if you need to answer, you said I’ll tell you the answer if.

00:06:59

Xochitl

You can prove.

00:07:00

Xochitl

That you’re following my Facebook page.

00:07:02

Jack

Yeah. You sent me your.

00:07:04

Jack

E-mail. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:07:05

Xochitl

Well, you like send me a screen capture the fact that it’s on his page and and I think he gained like $10,000 this year alone, but he was famous about it, but he really did. I would never do something like that. I’d never be like I’m not giving you information unless you send me a screenshot of you.

00:07:13

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:07:24

Xochitl

Following my Facebook page like it just seems like so like for us we would say like in poor.

00:07:30

Xochitl

Taste, you know.

00:07:32

Jack

Yeah, no, you and.

00:07:33

Jack

I would never do that. We would never hold anyone or any information hostage if someone, if one of our listeners came to us, you know, because we’re just like.

00:07:42

Jack

I mean, I don’t think we do. We don’t do this for the fame or or the the fortune or whatever. I think we just do it because we enjoy the process and you know that’s that’s not. But I I would love to to see the the podcast grow to.

00:08:00

Jack

The level of like those other major English language learning podcasts like I I wanted, I want to achieve that. I just want to do it in like an honest way.

00:08:11

Jack

Where and I.

00:08:12

Jack

And I’m not saying that those those.

00:08:13

Jack

Podcasts weren’t, you know, honest and.

00:08:18

Jack

I I guess what I’m saying is like they I think they were there early. They were early adapters. They kind of figured it out early. They saw something where we’re late adapters. You know we we’re jumping in into the lake when it’s already full of of people you know, it’s just like there’s not, there’s nothing special.

00:08:24

Xochitl

Right.

00:08:38

Jack

You know, we’re trying to.

00:08:39

Jack

Differentiate ourselves because I like to think of the A-Z as.

00:08:43

Jack

Like the we’re kind of.

00:08:44

Jack

The red headed stepchild of the.

00:08:47

Jack

Language learning base because we do things.

00:08:50

Jack

A little bit different. You know, it’s like it’s not as clean and refined and and like.

00:08:55

Xochitl

We’re not as organized. I think we.

00:08:57

Xochitl

Have a lot of heart though.

00:08:58

Xochitl

Like our community is.

00:08:59

Xochitl

Sincere we actually care a lot.

00:09:01

Xochitl

What our listeners, we know our listeners like on our personal level, those that are in the sub groups or the WeChat groups and Jack, you put a lot of effort into interacting with people. I was having so many issues with WhatsApp so.

00:09:13

Xochitl

I haven’t been.

00:09:14

Xochitl

Able to be as active as I.

00:09:15

Xochitl

Used to be and want to.

00:09:16

Xochitl

Be on chat but.

00:09:19

Jack

I’m I’m very close with a lot of our listeners in, in the WhatsApp group for sure and they they take some of our classes, our world English online, Google meets classes that we teach. So you know our our I know a lot of the listeners that listen to our podcast, some of them have that have been on our show.

00:09:39

Jack

You know they’ve they’ve come on in.

00:09:40

Jack

Guests but uh. But when you’re talking about like podcasting, we’re we have to scale it up to you want thousands and thousands of of listeners a day, you know, thousands of thousands of people listening each day. And you know, we’re we’re in the hundreds of people.

00:10:01

Jack

Which is still I.

00:10:02

Jack

Mean that’s a lot of people. Imagine A room.

00:10:03

Jack

Full of 100 and 5200.

00:10:05

Jack

People, and they’re all there for you, you know, like that would be amazing, you know.

00:10:06

Xochitl

Yeah, it’s, it’s.

00:10:12

Xochitl

Yeah, it’s not like we’re professors. I mean, you’re a professor at a university, right? It’s kind of.

00:10:16

Xochitl

Like that? Like being a Professor university and your class is successful and you have like 450 people. Your class is easy. A known as an easy Angel.

00:10:16

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:10:26

Jack

Well, I would never, I don’t think.

00:10:27

Jack

I could ever get a class full of 150 people at my own university, but yeah, I mean, just standing. You know, if I were in a room with with 300 people and they were all there to listen to me.

00:10:38

Jack

To you and me, talk, I I would be like, you know, honored it would be it’d be intimidating, you know? So it’s not. It’s not like we’re, you know, it’s not like.

00:10:50

Jack

We’re we’re not a.

00:10:50

Jack

Failing podcast. We’re just I think we’re stuck in like a kind of middle zone where I feel like we’re ready to break through.

00:10:58

Jack

We just need some kind of push or some kind of.

00:11:04

Jack

It’s it’s always, I guess what you always have to do is kind of keep tweaking and you keep adjusting until you find the right frequency and then you and and you can resonate with with an audience and and break through the noise I guess is what you.

00:11:21

발표자

I think.

00:11:23

Xochitl

We are a little unorganized because we’ve kind of.

00:11:25

Xochitl

Been seeing what?

00:11:26

Xochitl

Sticks like it’s a process. When you start up a podcast or social media page, you publish a lot of different types of content, and then you see what performs the best and you kind of try to repeat that formula in a structured way to ensure your success, you know.

00:11:45

Jack

Well, I’m. I’m good friends with uh with Robin Shaw Shaw English online.

00:11:49

Jack

And he, you know, the.

00:11:51

Jack

Advice he always gives me is testing. He’s always testing, testing new. You know, sticking with the stuff that works and then testing something new and and because you never know when you might just hit something.

00:12:04

Jack

That’s absolutely.

00:12:07

Jack

Just resonates with people on such a intense level, and that’s that’s what I think we’re always doing is, you know, couple episodes a week are are kind of in our wheelhouse, they’re comfortable. And then a couple episodes are kind of outside the box. And so, yeah, even after we, we’ve been doing this podcast.

00:12:27

Jack

For you and I have been doing it for about a year, Kevin and I did it for about 6 months, so together the podcast has been around for a year and a half. That’s relatively young for a podcast.

00:12:39

Jack

I mean, it doesn’t.

00:12:41

Jack

I I think I don’t think we’re.

00:12:44

Jack

I think the.

00:12:44

Jack

Success that we’ve had with this podcast is is above average for a a podcast our age. That’s my my my thinking I could be wrong. You know, obviously like famous people. You know, people that are celebrities and they start a podcast. It’s it starts off you’re already.

00:13:02

Jack

On a different level.

00:13:05

Jack

You know, but they’re that’s cause they’re they’re leveraging their fame that they had and bringing it into the podcast space. When you’re 2 unknown people like us. And we’re just starting from the ground up and building something. What we’ve accomplished is actually quite admirable. I think like it’s really it’s something special.

00:13:25

Jack

And to be able to, you know, keep growing that in a space that’s already saturated with a lot of a lot of people trying to do the exact same thing that we’re trying to do.

00:13:38

Jack

That’s why I tried. That’s why I’m I’m trying to.

00:13:41

Jack

Like I always say, this expression is zig when everyone else sags. You know, like that’s the that’s kind of the.

00:13:48

Jack

The theory behind this.

00:13:49

Jack

Podcast is like.

00:13:50

Jack

If everybody’s going to be doing this.

00:13:51

Jack

Kind of one way style. Why don’t we?

00:13:55

Jack

Do it a different way.

00:13:56

Jack

You know, so that’s why we kind of more free free form conversations that weren’t highly edited and we kind of speak at a normal speed and we we challenge our listeners to, you know, hold on for the roller coaster ride that is our conversation.

00:13:57

Xochitl

Right.

00:14:14

Jack

And that’s.

00:14:15

Xochitl

You know, because if they can, sorry, I didn’t mean to cut you off, Jack. I just. If they can do so, you know that they’re really applying their skills on a new level. That it when they come to the US or when they use their English language skills or when they use their speaking skills or their listening skills. You know that they are going to be.

00:14:18

Jack

No, no, no, go.

00:14:18

발표자

Ahead, go ahead.

00:14:34

Xochitl

Able to hold their own.

00:14:35

Xochitl

In a real life.

00:14:38

Jack

Yes, I I think that’s really important. I don’t do, I don’t really do teacher talk even even in my classroom. I just don’t believe in it. I think my students are better served listening to me speak at the rate that the normal rate that I that I normally speak at and and be prepared for what they’re actually going to encounter.

00:14:59

Jack

In the United States or Canada or England, then opposed to some kind of like you know.

00:15:06

Jack

Baby talk that I use in the classroom so that everybody can understand.

00:15:12

Jack

But when you get into the real world, no one’s gonna do that. You know, baby talk thing for you that’s sheltered, you know, talk. They’re gonna speak at a normal speed, and you’re gonna have to to be prepared.

00:15:24

Jack

For that, so I I don’t.

00:15:26

Jack

Know I that’s.

00:15:27

Jack

That’s always been my theory, my philosophy.

00:15:33

Jack

We try to.

00:15:33

Jack

Slow things down a little bit. The problem with you and me is that we we’re fast talkers, you know? And so, you know, it’s probably some people might tune into our podcast and go.

00:15:48

Jack

Wow, they they talk so fast, I can’t even, you know, this is way beyond my my level. So you know, that’s something that we, you and I could probably work on is like trying to slow down a little bit. But like I said, I don’t really believe in that. I kind of believe in, you know.

00:16:04

Jack

Learning the way it really is, the reality is, is always going to be more, more beneficial than some sort of sheltered, you know, English that we can give to them and and make them feel good in the moment. But then when they when they’re faced with the real.

00:16:24

Jack

Speaking situations real authentic language learning like English speaking experiences, they’re gonna have, they’re gonna struggle.

00:16:33

Jack

So I that’s just my my my feeling, but maybe we’re off off topic now a little bit, I don’t know.

00:16:40

Xochitl

A little, but it’s OK, you know, I think I think it all ties into the whole.

00:16:45

Xochitl

You know social media aspect and then another another last question I have for you about you know growing your social media personally I found in my journey with social media that content it’s like.

00:17:01

Xochitl

Uh, there’s a couple of reasons I feel like we’re starting a page. It’s not necessarily about, as you said, it’s like the delusion of success and whatnot. But for me and for you.

00:17:10

Xochitl

I believe as.

00:17:11

Xochitl

Well, more than.

00:17:13

Xochitl

Caring about success, I think it’s like we.

00:17:16

Xochitl

We enjoy what we’re doing and success to us means that people are also enjoying and responding to what we’re doing and so it’s nice to feel that like recognition and one thing I have noticed is that sometimes content that I never thought.

00:17:36

Xochitl

Would perform so well.

00:17:39

Xochitl

It like it does really well. And then content that I really didn’t try that hard on or that.

00:17:46

Xochitl

You know, that does really well. And then content that I really put my whole heart into or that I thought would perform amazingly, it kind of fell short and UM.

00:17:57

Xochitl

The social media.

00:17:58

Jack

Space is completely upside down from what I learned as a communications major as an undergrad, like when when I was young. If you make something good, people will find.

00:18:09

Jack

Need it. You know what I mean? Like, if it’s good people. Now, if you make something good. But it has a bad thumbnail, they’ll never find it.

00:18:13

발표자

Right.

00:18:19

Jack

Like but if you have a good thumbnail, a great thumbnail and mediocre content.

00:18:19

Xochitl

The way.

00:18:27

Jack

That that’ll perform better than, uh. So, right. So like you said that 3 second thing is really important. It’s like if you can’t grab, if you can’t grab the audience’s attention in three seconds and.

00:18:42

Jack

I don’t know. Maybe you know, I’m thinking like.

00:18:45

Jack

How does that translate to the podcasting space? Because I’m talking about the YouTube space and Facebook space where.

00:18:50

Jack

You are with your.

00:18:52

Jack

Your travel blog your your travel page because it’s all about like a good a good thumbnail grabbing the attention.

00:19:00

Jack

And then people will watch your content and the content does. I’ve seen such like, mediocre kind of just boring.

00:19:08

Jack

Sent get huge numbers.

00:19:13

Jack

And I’m just totally baffled by it. Like.

00:19:16

Jack

I’m I don’t.

00:19:16

Jack

Understand it. Why is that video so amazing performing so well and a lot of times it’s like YouTube will promote things.

00:19:28

Jack

Internally, like, they’ll test things and stuff, so your YouTube might grab your video and show it to 100,000 people.

00:19:37

Xochitl

Right.

00:19:37

Jack

And just to see how it performs.

00:19:40

Jack

Just a test.

00:19:41

Jack

It’s just part of an algorithm and.

00:19:46

Jack

And so it’s nothing to do with you, it’s just YouTube kind of randomly choosing stuff. And I think Facebook probably does the same thing right? It’ll it’ll. It’ll test it and take your your stuff and show it to 100,000 people. And then if it doesn’t perform well, then they’ll they’ll throw you away for a while.

00:20:05

Jack

Well, and then you go to the back of the line. It’s like you had your chance. Your, your, your. Yeah, you blew it because your your content didn’t meet the standard that people want. So now you go back in line and you start over again, you know, in the podcasting space is a little bit different because there is no like thumbnail.

00:20:27

Jack

You know, we just have our logo and that’s what so people if that don’t know, our podcasts are just scrolling through. And I think we have a good logo. I think the logo is nice.

00:20:38

Jack

I think maybe in something I could try and I’m just thinking out loud is not do any sort of opening music, just jump right into the conversation.

00:20:51

발표자

Right.

00:20:52

Jack

UM.

00:20:54

발표자

So I might I.

00:20:54

Jack

Might try that this week, you know, and just and just bring have closing.

00:20:59

발표자

I think.

00:20:59

Jack

But we don’t.

00:21:00

Jack

Need the introduction to the podcast? We can just get right into the conversation immediately so that people don’t have to wait, you know 15 seconds because like you said, 3 seconds is is is all you need for a real well 15 seconds is a lifetime, you know.

00:21:18

Xochitl

Yeah, I think.

00:21:19

Jack

In this modern.

00:21:21

Xochitl

Jack, I think what you were taught as a communications major and even what I was taught as an English major, even though I just recently went through college, a lot of things that were taught and that are professors believe are outdated. And I think it’s because of this. We were taught that there’s like an introduction, you know, like a.

00:21:40

Xochitl

A hook IMAX and an ending and now?

00:21:43

Xochitl

All you have is your.

00:21:44

Xochitl

Hook. That’s pretty much it.

00:21:47

Xochitl

It’s like there’s so much competition now that all you have going for you is your hook. If your content isn’t like hook after hook after hook, you’re flatlined. It’s just not going the way that it needs to be.

00:22:01

Jack

I do, yeah.

00:22:04

Xochitl

And I think also with content like it’s no longer what’s good or what’s quality content and what’s bad and what’s poor quality content, it’s all about what’s attention grabbing like. If you see a thumbnail of a girl.

00:22:18

Xochitl

Eating the raw octopus from Korea like you’re going to get like a million clicks on that versus you might have a really great video of someone, a guy or girl talking about like oh, this sashimi is really delicious and they might actually go into detail and crack the whole quality content about it.

00:22:38

Xochitl

But because it’s not like attention grabbing, it’s not like what the heck are that? Is that person eating what’s going on? Like, what does that taste like? The curiosity and the tension grabbing aspect of it is like pretty much all we have, like, shock value is a huge social media now.

00:22:55

Jack

Like 3.

00:22:56

Jack

Three teenagers or young 20s people who are attractive laughing and giggling while trying to eat octopus versus like a a chef who’s in his 40s. But he’s like a works at like A2 Michelin star restaurant.

00:23:16

Jack

You know or whatever.

00:23:17

Jack

Explaining the delicacy of that of of eating it, you know, one is like.

00:23:25

Jack

One is what the first version of that is like, fast food. You know what I mean? Like entertainment. It’s just like McDonald’s. The second one video is, like, actually has information and knowledge and perspective. And that’s like a like a nutritious meal. But where does everybody go? You know, everyone gravitates towards the like.

00:23:45

Jack

Junk food, you know, just give me.

00:23:47

Xochitl

Right.

00:23:49

Xochitl

Yeah, because at the end, sorry.

00:23:51

Xochitl

Jack, I didn’t cut you off there.

00:23:52

Xochitl

But at the end.

00:23:53

Xochitl

All about your audience, and I feel like audience for high quality, high production content like maybe the chef at the Michelin restaurant. That’s for like an older generation and the people who are scrolling Facebook wheels, Instagram wheels, I know a lot of people say only old people.

00:24:09

Xochitl

Facebook. But that’s not true. I would never young and I use it. People who are on there scrolling those pages are mostly young people, and they’re gonna watch the weird stuff, the shock value, stuff, the funny fun content they want.

00:24:27

Xochitl

That easy to digest, short, entertaining content above anything else, and they prioritize shock value and they prioritize. Find their content and something that gives them a laugh or something that weirds them out. And that’s kind of the formula that you have to follow when you want to hook people these days. And you know talking.

00:24:47

Xochitl

This is just like made me think so much about how I run my page because I kind of run it as a soothing or an informational content page. And I think if I want to pick up popularities here, I need to focus a lot.

00:24:58

Xochitl

On like shock.

00:25:03

Xochitl

Like shock, all you find the interesting stuff.

00:25:06

Jack

Yeah, yeah, yeah, you.

00:25:07

Jack

It’s it’s all about that first.

00:25:09

Jack

If if you can, I don’t know.

00:25:11

Jack

Do you make?

00:25:11

Jack

Thumbnails and stuff like that for your videos or.

00:25:15

Xochitl

I do. I usually use like.

00:25:17

Xochitl

If I’m doing one on.

00:25:20

Xochitl

Like I did one recently yesterday, like the best news I saw in 2023 and so my thumbnail was just a nice view. And yes, it’s pretty and stuff, but I think that kind of suiting content doesn’t perform as well as something where a person can’t tell what they’re looking at and they’re so intrigued they want to click on the video.

00:25:40

Jack

I’m. I’m not. I’m not like a I’m not good at at making thumbnails, but you know better than I used to be. But yeah, I would. I would do.

00:25:48

Jack

Like take a.

00:25:49

Jack

Little thumbnail tutorial on YouTube and then start thumb making thumbnails for your videos and see if that doesn’t like.

00:25:58

Jack

You know if.

00:25:59

Jack

You if you get some of those like.

00:26:01

Jack

Some of those.

00:26:02

Jack

Kind of thumbnails where you’re like, you know.

00:26:04

Jack

I don’t know. Making a facial.

00:26:06

Jack

Expression of surprise or whatever, you know like.

00:26:08

Jack

Oh, and then you know, some background.

00:26:11

Jack

Or you know what, I.

00:26:12

Jack

Mean like something where people?

00:26:13

Jack

Are just like they they.

00:26:14

Jack

Have to click on it because they want to know like what’s what is. What’s this about, you know? Yeah.

00:26:19

Xochitl

Hi this is about.

00:26:21

Xochitl

And the last thing that I think would really up our content for both the ABC English podcasts and my.

00:26:30

Xochitl

Is putting our faces out there more? I think this year we do have the goal once my Internet teacher improves of having our faces on the podcast and posting it on YouTube and.

00:26:41

Xochitl

For me like.

00:26:42

Xochitl

Including my face more in my travel content because I’ve noticed that it doesn’t really matter. I’m not saying that.

00:26:48

Xochitl

You or I aren’t attractive, but it doesn’t really matter necessarily how attractive a person is. I’ve seen plenty of like 40 year old, much bunkers and stuff like and travel bloggers. He’s still really successful, but it’s like people want to connect with that.

00:26:57

발표자

OK.

00:27:03

Xochitl

Personal well, like on a personal level. And when you see a bunch of pretty scenes or a bunch of pictures of food, but you don’t really see anyone eating it. Like there’s so many successful videos of just like a person eating food and what, like, it’s just weird to me. It was like, oh, I took all these, like, nice shots.

00:27:06

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:27:23

Xochitl

Of the food. But there’s no pictures of me eating it. And it’s like my content didn’t perform that well and there’s these ones and this girl, just like eating crap and like they performed really well. But it’s like, I think people just develop a parent social relationship, which for our listeners who.

00:27:38

Xochitl

You don’t understand what that means. It’s like when you feel that the person on the screen is your friend, basically, and in this information age like I think.

00:27:50

Xochitl

That’s kind of an important aspect. They don’t want to.

00:27:53

Xochitl

Sound weird about that? Like.

00:27:54

Xochitl

I don’t think it’s necessarily always a negative thing.

00:27:57

Jack

No, no, I.

00:27:57

Xochitl

It can be really.

00:27:59

Jack

The parasocial that I’m glad you brought that up.

00:28:02

Jack

Because that’s that’s huge.

00:28:04

Jack

That is like that. You are the in on the A-Z English podcast. If we do a YouTube channel and just do our podcast but we record video and I upload it there, the the viewer is now the third person in the room. You know what I mean? Like you you’re you’re sitting, you’re sitting in that third. There’s like a third empty.

00:28:25

Jack

Share and and we call it. Sometimes we sometimes we.

00:28:27

Jack

Call it the 4th.

00:28:28

Jack

Wall and you know, you know I’m talking about like, you know, you know and.

00:28:31

Xochitl

Yeah, yeah.

00:28:34

Xochitl

Oh yeah.

00:28:35

Jack

Breaking the 4th wall would be like we’re talking to you as as like the the.

00:28:39

Jack

The third person in the.

00:28:41

Jack

And I had. I had this huge pair of social relationship with this, with this podcast where the IT was a politics podcast, right?

00:28:53

Jack

And it really.

00:28:54

Jack

Shaped my politics, this one broadcaster this that got one of the podcasters. The guy on the podcast was named. His name was.

00:29:01

Jack

Michael brooks.

00:29:02

Jack

And and his his insight and intelligence on the political landscape and everything informed me for years. Like I would just and he and he was also wickedly funny. So it was like this really enjoyable experience where I was learning tons about American politics and foreign foreign affairs.

00:29:23

Jack

And then also laughing hysterically. Well, suddenly he died one day. He’s 37 years old. Aneurysm’s gone.

00:29:34

Jack

Hit hit me like a shovel. Like I swear to you, I have never. I didn’t realize that I had a parasocial relationship with this person because it it hurt like a friend dying for three days. You know, it was. It was just like a like a gut punch.

00:29:54

Jack

You know, I I cried like you know what?

00:29:57

Jack

I mean like and.

00:29:58

Jack

And I realized like this is weird. I’m crying over the death of a person that doesn’t even know I’m exist. That doesn’t.

00:30:05

Jack

Even know I’m alive?

00:30:07

발표자

Right.

00:30:07

Jack

Yet he was so open and so honest, and so intelligent, and it’s such a good broadcaster or podcaster that he made me feel like we were friends. Like, that’s a that’s a special talent. You know, people that can do that. And so that parasocial relationship especially.

00:30:26

Jack

In a time where we’re so atomized and so like fragmented as like a, you know, as a, as a culture, as a society, right?

00:30:33

Xochitl

Anxiety jam.

00:30:36

Jack

And that people are looking for that. And so I think you’re right, if you’re, if you start swimming towards those waters, you’re going to have more success. You know what I mean? Like and. And. And I I don’t think it’s like I don’t think it necessarily is.

00:30:52

Jack

A bad thing?

00:30:53

Jack

I don’t what?

00:30:53

Jack

Do you think do you?

00:30:54

Jack

Think a parasocial.

00:30:55

Jack

Relationship is, I mean I I don’t think like.

00:30:58

Jack

That should be the number one objective of your channel of your, of your, of your.

00:31:03

Jack

Age. But like if it happens if people just feel like they become your friend, I think that’s OK.

00:31:04

Xochitl

Right.

00:31:11

Jack

I guess it’s.

00:31:12

Jack

Just up to what you’re you know what you’re willing to to what you’re comfortable with. You know what I mean? Like.

00:31:18

Xochitl

Yeah, I think that a parasocial relationship gets a bad rap, but I don’t think it’s a bad thing. I think that where society is so fragmented and there’s still a lot of isolation and effects from the pandemic that it can help you feel less lonely. I remember during the pandemic I was a huge fan of Emma.

00:31:32

Jack

Right.

00:31:38

Xochitl

Chamberlain and she’s a YouTuber. Famous YouTuber who?

00:31:43

Xochitl

Breaks the 4th wall really often and makes you feel like you’re there with her wherever she goes, like you’re hanging out with her or you’re going on this adventure with her, or you’re just cooking with her in her kitchen and it’s just like people, creators who are successful.

00:32:00

Xochitl

And connecting with their audience on that level and helping people feel less lonely and helping people feel more connected to them as creators and as people are usually the ones who are really successful.

00:32:15

Xochitl

And I think it’s a big aspect of why.

00:32:21

Xochitl

When TV was invented, radio died out as well. It’s like being able to see someone and.

00:32:25

Jack

Right.

00:32:30

Xochitl

The amount of love that people could feel for a television star or celebrity because you’re seeing that person and you’re following their career talk shows. For example. I mean, podcasts have existed since invention of television, and they were talk shows before, basically, and they were, well, really successful because people were sitting at their homes and they felt validated in their opinions.

00:32:51

Xochitl

Or they thought they were learning something.

00:32:52

Xochitl

Any shows or they’re just being entertained and having a good time. And I think that that level of human connection is what we seek and we use technology for that purpose moving forward through social media. And I think that’s what makes certain social media pages so successful.

00:33:09

Jack

Yeah, I Robin Shaw of Shaw English online is he’s kind of been my North star when it comes to.

00:33:16

Jack

Like social media and stuff like that, I respect his opinions a lot and he said to to me for for you and I and for you and me or for you and I to have success in in the space we need to get our our YouTube channel up with video because right now like a lot of the the.

00:33:36

Jack

Because that would put us ahead of the curve.

00:33:38

Jack

Little bit.

00:33:39

Jack

And I’ll tell you why.

00:33:41

Jack

So we jumped into the audio space, which is like you said is.

00:33:44

Jack

Is like going back to old timey radio, you know.

00:33:47

Jack

Well, the only difference is you can just listen to whenever you want, but that’s what a podcast is. It’s a radio show. I mean, the talk to talk about like, you know, the antiquated like, you know.

00:33:59

Jack

Old you know.

00:34:01

Jack

Yeah. So we hopped into space and we did we.

00:34:04

Jack

Did all right, you know?

00:34:06

Jack

In order to.

00:34:07

Jack

Take it to the next level and a.

00:34:09

Jack

Lot of these.

00:34:09

Jack

Podcasts don’t do this is start recording your podcast with video.

00:34:15

Jack

Putting it on YouTube and then giving people the opportunity to either watch it on YouTube or listen to it, and now you now you’ve got two different mediums that you’re, you know, so we so.

00:34:29

Jack

We’ve we’ve made, we’ve taken.

00:34:30

Jack

Some steps right, we’ve got our.

00:34:31

Jack

Lighting issues a little.

00:34:32

Jack

Bit better what we once we get the.

00:34:35

Jack

Wi-Fi situation sorted out. We’ll we’ll be able to kind of make it look like.

00:34:40

Jack

A A proper.

00:34:42

Jack

Studio, you know.

00:34:43

Jack

Where we’re even though we’re recording in different country.

00:34:46

Jack

And I think in that case, at that point you and I will have stepped up. Uh, we’ll we’ll made a step forward like a step up or whatever. We, we’ll we’ll have taken a big step up because, you know, we’ll we’ll now be the podcast that you can watch like a show or.

00:35:06

Jack

To like a radio show. So I think that’ll really help us.

00:35:11

Jack

I’m I’m not.

00:35:12

Jack

Sure. I don’t know if you think if you agree or not, but.

00:35:15

Xochitl

Yeah, I definitely agree. And I’m I’m with it and I think we should make it a New Year’s resolution for the podcast this year.

00:35:24

Jack

Right, yes, this is our 20.

00:35:25

Xochitl

Yeah. So the 24 solution for the A-Z English podcast and the Jack and Jill Sub podcast, yeah.

00:35:26

Jack

24 New Year’s resolution is.

00:35:38

Jack

Yeah, we’ve already got a YouTube channel. You know what I mean? So we’ve got YouTube channel. We’re already uploading everything there, but you, you go to the YouTube channel, you can only listen to it. Imagine if you could just go there, see our faces, be that third person in the room and feel like you’re you’re hanging out with a couple of friends learning English that.

00:35:58

Jack

I mean that that would would.

00:35:59

Jack

Have a lot of appeal, I think.

00:36:01

Jack

And so that’s.

00:36:03

Jack

That’s where I that’s where we want to take.

00:36:05

Jack

This so yeah, yeah.

00:36:08

Xochitl

Listeners let us know what are your suggestions for 2024 to grow our social media page and our podcast. Follow us at A-Z englishpodcast@gmail.com. Oh, sorry. Leave us a comment down below at AZ with podcast.com. Follow us on our WhatsApp group on our WeChat group and e-mail us at A-Z.

00:36:29

Xochitl

Podcast@gmail.com and if you feel so inclined to follow my travel blog on Facebook.

00:36:36

Xochitl

Or on Instagram on both of those places, it’s so Lenny travels, which is a mixture of my two names, Emily and social XOCLEMI.

00:36:48

Xochitl

Travels, TRAVELS, and that’s on Facebook and Instagram and we will see you guys next time. Bye bye.

00:36:57

Jack

Bye bye.

00:37:09

발표자

OK.

Podcast:

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Transcript:

00:00:00

Xochitl

You are listening to the Jack and Chill podcast alright, Jack. For this episode of Jack and Chill I have a fun game of this or that which for viewers.

00:00:20

Xochitl

Means that I will ask Jack whether he would prefer one option or a second option and he will tell me which one he prefers and then I will also answer.

00:00:30

Xochitl

So Jack, do you prefer fruit cake, which is a holiday dessert that is kind of unpopular in the US? It's basically a kind of like a loaf of cake with candied fruits incorporated into it. Or ambrosia salad, which is a creamy.

00:00:50

Xochitl

Sweet salad with several different types of fruit and fruit flavored marshmallows in it.

00:00:59

Jack

Yeah. You know, when I was a kid, I would have said ambrosia salad. I would prefer that because it's kind of the texture is kind of like it's kind of like jello jello or, you know, kind of a Jelly.

00:01:14

Xochitl

Yeah, like a sweet whipped.

00:01:16

Jack

Yes, sweet whipped, very light. It's it's you.

00:01:20

Jack

You know the expression.

00:01:21

Jack

There's always room for Jello, you know? So at the end of of a big meal, you could still eat a little bit of ambrosia salad and it's not going to fill you up too much. And it's sweet, but now I've I think it's disgusting. It's way too sweet. It's just.

00:01:40

Jack

I would rather have a a slice of fruitcake.

00:01:43

Jack

To be honest.

00:01:45

Jack

I don't mind fruitcake that much. I mean, I know that it's it's not my favorite dessert, but it's got some nuts in it. It's got some.

00:01:56

Jack

A little bit of candied fruit and a little bit of cake, so you know it's not. It's not too much, it's it doesn't overload the senses like ambrosia salad does.

00:02:10

Jack

I don't know. What do you think?

00:02:12

Xochitl

Uhm, I never liked ambrosia salad, even as a kid I had kind of weird taste buds, like I prefer dark chocolate over milk chocolate. Even from being a little child and.

00:02:23

Xochitl

I I would drink.

00:02:23

Jack

Yeah, that's sophisticated.

00:02:25

Xochitl

Black Coffee, also as a child, is the Mexico kids drink coffee. I had. I did add some sugar into it, but I wouldn't put any milk and I didn't like it. Very sweet because I like the like kind of bitter flavor profile.

00:02:40

Xochitl

So I always had weird taste buds and.

00:02:42

Xochitl

I hated hamburger salad. It was just horrible and I would say I would pick fruit cake even though as a kid I also didn't like the texture of like the candied fruits, raisins and like nuts in it.

00:02:54

Xochitl

I would pick. I would pick those out, but now as an adult, I think I could just eat the whole thing. I think with like a coffee.

00:03:00

Xochitl

Be or like a.

00:03:04

Xochitl

One chip which we make in Mexico, which is like the hot.

00:03:06

Xochitl

Fruit punch. Drink, I think.

00:03:07

Xochitl

That it would be tolerable.

00:03:10

Jack

Yeah, I would.

00:03:11

Jack

I would be right now I would be very satisfied with a slice of fruit cake and a a latte.

00:03:18

Jack

Like that would be. That would be nice like with my neck but a.

00:03:22

Xochitl

I'll be hitting on Jack.

00:03:22

Jack

Like a bowl.

00:03:23

Jack

Of a bowl of marshmallows with you know, Jello and whip and whipped cream does not.

00:03:27

Xochitl

With green.

00:03:30

Jack

It doesn't sound good to me. It's just a. Yeah, it's nasty.

00:03:35

Xochitl

Right now, yeah, I can't imagine it would be, like, hard to get a spoon down and then with the food cake, it's like, yeah, I could do it. You know, I I wouldn't mind, actually. Yeah.

00:03:44

Xochitl

I got you. All right, Jack, for next one. Do you prefer eggnog or hot chocolate?

00:03:50

Jack

Yeah, I know we're going to have a a bitter argument about this one, but I love.

00:03:56

Jack

I love it.

00:03:56

Xochitl

You know what? I've come around to eggnog.

00:03:59

Xochitl

I'll let you finish, but I'll let you finish.

00:03:59

Jack

Oh, OK. Yeah. I'm a big eggnog fan. My dad used to buy because they only sold it seasonally. And where I go.

00:04:09

Xochitl

Uh-huh. It's still only sold seasonally.

00:04:11

Jack

Yeah, and it was. My dad used to buy one called Holly Nog. That was like the name of the company and dog. It was just like you. Like a milk carton, but instead out came this, like, think. I don't know how to describe. It's so thick. Like it's just thick, thick.

00:04:17

Xochitl

So I yeah.

00:04:31

Jack

Like and a thick liquid and and you drink it cold and it's not milk, but it's kind of it's Milky.

00:04:40

Xochitl

It's kind of.

00:04:40

Xochitl

Like a custard, like a liquid custard.

00:04:43

Jack

Yeah, exactly. It's very much like a liquid custard, but I.

00:04:47

Xochitl

In fact it is. It has eggs very good.

00:04:47

발표자

Always found.

00:04:50

Jack

Yeah. Well, I just like to take, like, a coffee cup with a half a coffee, coffee cup of eggnog, and. And it's so heavy. And it's so rich that you could just take little sips. And it feels like you're taking a whole bite of some kind of dessert. It's like drinking a dessert based.

00:05:10

Jack

Am I? I know the calories.

00:05:12

Jack

In there have to be astronomical like.

00:05:14

Xochitl

Ohh it's bad because I had like it said for like 4 oz. It's like over 200 calories and I definitely have like 2.

00:05:21

Xochitl

8 oz cups today so I I just found like 800 calories of.

00:05:26

Xochitl

The eggnog in one day.

00:05:30

Jack

I mean, I could drink a whole carton of it, to be honest. Like I I tried to make it once even and it didn't turn out too well. I put too much vanilla extract in it and it made my throat hurt.

00:05:40

Xochitl

Oh yeah.

00:05:44

Jack

So yeah, it can. It burned, but I you know, I love. I love eggnog and I'm not. I'm not a big hot chocolate drinker. I just don't. I've got a bunch in my house and it just expires because no one drinks it.

00:05:44

Xochitl

Ohh burn.

00:05:58

Xochitl

Is it like the Swiss news type that you have though, like the instant hot cocoa?

00:06:02

Jack

Yeah, it's not like real. It's not real hot chocolate. It's just the the exactly, it's the powder.

00:06:04

발표자

That's what.

00:06:09

Jack

That you mix with hot.

00:06:10

Jack

Warm milk or or water if you.

00:06:14

Jack

I think the water, it tastes the worst. You know, if you mix it with milk.

00:06:17

Xochitl

Yeah, but if you hate yourself.

00:06:19

Xochitl

And drink it with water.

00:06:20

Jack

Yeah, yeah. I mean, that's just it's just sugar water and it's really gross. But with milk it it's it's a little bit better. I just, I just don't like to get my calories from drinks. Usually. Yeah, unless, you know, I do, I do drink milk, but I drink it with my coffee.

00:06:41

Jack

Cause I love ice lattes, so I will drink. You know, a lot of coffee with with milk.

00:06:42

발표자

Right.

00:06:50

Xochitl

But it's like a splash.

00:06:51

Xochitl

Of milk in your coffee. Not like.

00:06:53

Jack

Ohh no, I drink like full actually I I just lied to you. I drink a lot of calories. Uh, actually if you count milk because I'll put like I'll make a really strong like 3 espresso shots and then fill up a cup with ice and then the rest is milk. It's probably it's only half a cup of milk. It's because there's so much ice.

00:07:14

Jack

Dinner but.

00:07:15

Xochitl

Right.

00:07:16

Jack

I'll drink those. Like I'll drink like two or three.

00:07:18

Jack

A day because.

00:07:19

Xochitl

OK, but that but milk does have some nutritional value. You're not really getting sugar like sugar calories for that, which is something I do admire because I definitely drink a lot of my calories lately. I mean, I had a full I have like a 16 ounce coke and.

00:07:36

Xochitl

28 oz cups of eggnogs just today, so I definitely drink my calories. I try.

00:07:41

발표자

Yeah. Yeah. Well.

00:07:42

Xochitl

To be more mindful that in the new.

00:07:43

Jack

Year it's so it's so easy to do and I mean I do. I do sometimes drink calories too because like I said, I I drink, I drink milk and.

00:07:56

Jack

And but I you know I.

00:07:57

Jack

Drink diet soda sometimes. So that's, you know, got its own problems related to it so.

00:08:06

Jack

I'm I'm by no means like Mr. healthy.

00:08:09

Jack

Over here on my high horse, you know?

00:08:12

Xochitl

You know, I as I've gotten older, I have come around to eggnog, so it's not the horrible choice I would have vilified you for before, but I don't like the like the Holly nod. Like I don't like the brand that you're talking about. It tastes. There's, like, a really strong nutmeg flavor to that brand that's like overpowering.

00:08:32

Xochitl

And it's like too thick and too sweet.

00:08:35

Xochitl

And and I like when I was younger, I used to prefer silk, not like the the the I guess vegan option that was made with soy milk because it was thinner.

00:08:51

Xochitl

And it wasn't so thick. It was like a texture thing, and it had less of a really intense, like eggy and not Maggie type of flavor. So I put, I would ask my parents to purchase some milk. Not is what I would drink. I would not drink the regular eggnog because it was.

00:08:59

Jack

OK.

00:09:06

Xochitl

Nasty because.

00:09:06

Xochitl

It was like thick and.

00:09:08

Xochitl

My sister really loved.

00:09:10

Xochitl

Eggnog and I just was never a fan.

00:09:13

Xochitl

And in recent.

00:09:14

Xochitl

Years I've actually come around to it. Only specific brands I like. There's a brand here in Iowa called Kelowna, Supernatural, and it's like an organic, I guess, milk, but it's like the eggnog is pretty thin and it has like cinnamon and stuff in it.

00:09:34

Xochitl

And it's it's very kind of like thin. It's so creamy, but it doesn't have that custardy like flavor or thickness.

00:09:40

Jack

Yeah, it's almost comfy.

00:09:43

Jack

Then it comes up, yeah.

00:09:44

Xochitl

Yeah, it's not like clumpy or like thick. So I really enjoyed that actually. And I've come around to it. But that being said, I do prefer hot chocolate and that's because I don't drink the little sweet.

00:09:59

Xochitl

Packets. I always bring chocolate from Mexico and.

00:10:03

Xochitl

You dissolve that.

00:10:04

Xochitl

And milk.

00:10:06

Xochitl

And drink it. And I like to add some marshmallows in the bottom of the cup and then put like, some whipped cream on top and go to town on that.

00:10:15

Jack

You just make real hot real hot chocolate. Like the way it's supposed to be made you mix. You put real chocolate in with milk and and then you can add the the sugar. You don't even have to add that much sugar, probably because the marshmallows are sweetening it up.

00:10:31

Jack

Enough. Yeah, I don't add.

00:10:33

Xochitl

Any sugar actually? Because it's like dark chocolate. But it is sweetened some.

00:10:37

Jack

Oh, OK, so it's sweet and dark chocolate. OK. Yeah, that sounds really nice. That sounds wonderful. Yeah.

00:10:43

Xochitl

Yeah. And the Mexican one had it comes with like cinnamon and some other like spices in it incorporated into it.

00:10:52

발표자

OK.

00:10:52

Xochitl

So yeah, it has a really rich, nutty flavor, cause it's like the actual cocoa beans that have been like, crushed and processed. Yeah. So it's tasty.

00:11:04

Jack

I mean, I would be OK with either option to be honest, but The thing is, I haven't had eggnog for.

00:11:10

Jack

Probably 20 years, so I just miss it. You know, they don't sell it where I live. Here. I live in Korea so that we don't have eggnog here. You have to make your own and.

00:11:22

Jack

I don't know. I'm too lazy to do that so.

00:11:25

Jack

I think just buying Holly Nog in America would be would be kind of nice just one time.

00:11:33

Xochitl

Yeah. And it's so special because it's like you can only really have it around the like very specific like from November to December maybe or like November to the very beginning of like the end of November to the very beginning of January is when you can find eggnog on the shelves and.

00:11:50

Xochitl

You kind of get like a a month and maybe a couple of weeks like six weeks of eggnog time at at the Max. And then it's just completely gone off the shelves and you can't buy it anywhere. So.

00:12:03

Jack

You can go to McDonald's and you can.

00:12:04

Jack

Get an eggnog shake, which are amazing those are.

00:12:08

Xochitl

Is that a real?

00:12:09

Xochitl

Thing I've never had that before.

00:12:10

Jack

Yes, yes, they have the Shamrock shake, which is around Saint Patrick's Day, which is.

00:12:16

Jack

Mint and then they have the around the holiday season, they've got the eggnog shake.

00:12:24

Xochitl

I may have to try that. I'm sure it's going to be like 1000.

00:12:27

Xochitl

Calories in.

00:12:27

Xochitl

One I got I have.

00:12:27

Jack

Ohh yeah, it's a.

00:12:29

Xochitl

To give it a try though now.

00:12:30

Jack

You gotta try it though.

00:12:31

Xochitl

That you've talked about it. Gotta try it. Alright, Jack. Now what about Christmas? Ham or Christmas Turkey? Which do you prefer? And which did you grow up with? I'm curious as well.

00:12:44

Jack

Both we've we've done turkeys and we've done hams.

00:12:48

Jack

UMI think maybe we did more turkeys than hams. If I'm not mistaken, but I'll take a Christmas ham any day of the week like over a A Christmas Turkey. You.

00:12:59

Xochitl

Know Turkey is.

00:13:00

Jack

Nice on Thanksgiving, but it's very dry. It's kind of, it's a dry meat. It's not like it's not necessarily.

00:13:09

Jack

The most delicious bird meat or poultry that you can that you can eat. I I love it but I eat it for nostalgic purposes but a ham. Ohh man. A really nice ham is is so good like ohh man. Couple slices of ham with some potatoes and.

00:13:29

Jack

Yeah, it's just a beautiful.

00:13:33

Jack

Meal. Yeah, I I miss. I missed the Christmas ham, to be honest.

00:13:38

Jack

What about you?

00:13:39

Xochitl

You know.

00:13:41

Xochitl

If I could choose anything, I would choose Doc. I think to make on Christmas, but that wasn't one of the.

00:13:46

Jack

Oh yeah. OK.

00:13:48

Xochitl

Options so I will go.

00:13:50

Xochitl

With ham as well, I think Turkey, it's just pretty bland. The only time I had really good Turkey was my grandpa, and I think my cousin like made a recipe together.

00:14:02

Xochitl

There where it was like Turkey Al Pastor, which is like a Mexican Taco kind of seasoning, but not like what you would typically think of as Taco seasoning in the Midwest as like chipotles and like some other dried chilies and adobo, like, mixed in a spice.

00:14:22

Xochitl

Mix and then.

00:14:23

Xochitl

Rubbed on the Turkey and it was really good. It made the Turkey super super flavorful.

00:14:31

Xochitl

But besides that, I've just never been a huge tricky fan. I'm OK with the leg as well, like I prefer the leg over the breast or anything, but I just. I'm not a Turkey fan. I mean, as you said, go ahead.

00:14:42

Jack

Yeah. No, I'm sorry. It was just, it's easy to make it to. It's easy to dry out the Turkey if you if it's cooked properly, where people aren't adding water, basting it, you know, a couple sticks of butter, you know, all over it, you know, it can really make it.

00:15:00

Jack

Make it delicious.

00:15:01

Jack

This so it it depends on how it's prepared I think.

00:15:06

Xochitl

Yeah, I mean, I've definitely had it. The most delicious Turkey, and it still wasn't it just it's harder to make that delicious and like it if you just put a ham in there, you know, rub some spices or some hot honey on it or something and stick it in the oven, you know, it's gonna come out good.

00:15:23

Jack

And it even just even just it just bakes in its own fat.

00:15:28

Xochitl

Yeah. And it comes out like good every time pretty much it's just lots of a hassle. I I just.

00:15:30

Jack

Yeah, right.

00:15:33

Xochitl

Prefer it to cooking the Turkey so you know.

00:15:40

Xochitl

I I am also a a ham fan. What about?

00:15:45

Xochitl

Candy canes or chocolate oranges. Now, candy canes uh for viewers who are unfamiliar are these little.

00:15:53

Xochitl

Cane shaped candies that are white and red, and they have a strong peppermint flavor. A very strong peppermint flavor, and then the chocolate orange is very popular here in the US and it's just a chocolate shaped like an orange. It even has little wedges that come out of its.

00:16:13

Xochitl

Whole and it's just kind of orange flavored, but it does have like an artificial orange flavoring in my opinion.

00:16:21

Jack

Yeah, I mean the, the, the when it.

00:16:24

Jack

Comes to like eating.

00:16:26

Jack

I'd probably rather eat the chocolate orange.

00:16:29

Jack

Then the candy cane.

00:16:31

Jack

But if you're if you're talking about aesthetics, you know, like like the the look of it like I'd rather have a Christmas with candy canes and no chocolate orange.

00:16:42

Jack

Is if that makes sense, because we used to decorate our tree with candy canes and we put them on the tree and then you could, you know, if you're, like, need a mint or something and you're, you know, you could take one and break off a.

00:16:57

Jack

Piece but to eat?

00:16:58

Jack

A whole candy cane is is.

00:17:01

Xochitl

Kind of overwhelming.

00:17:02

Jack

Yeah, it's too much mint. It's it's not good.

00:17:09

Xochitl

I kind of only like could glean in white ones. They're they come in different colors and the green and white ones have the like experiment flavor. Have you had those?

00:17:16

Jack

Yeah, I know what you're talking about. Yeah, they have fruity ones they have.

00:17:18

Xochitl

Little different.

00:17:20

Jack

All kinds of different.

00:17:21

Xochitl

They have bubble gum flavored ones. I do like those, actually bubble gum ones and the lemon ones like the lemon ones that are. But yeah, I think the aesthetics are very Christmas thing. The red and white are the green and white are the red and green and white candy canes. But.

00:17:40

Xochitl

I even though.

00:17:42

Xochitl

I don't really like the chocolate orange because.

00:17:44

Xochitl

It's it's kind of artificial tasting, I think I'd still rather eat it just because the candy cane gets so overwhelming after a while.

00:17:52

Jack

Yeah, yeah. I'm not gonna do the.

00:17:54

Jack

Candy cane. Take my I don't.

00:17:57

Jack

Think my teeth could handle it anymore, you know?

00:18:00

Xochitl

It's like burning your mouth too, and it's.

00:18:03

Xochitl

Yeah, I don't know.

00:18:03

Jack

Sugar. It's just eat. You're just eating a.

00:18:05

Jack

Sugar like if I'm.

00:18:07

Jack

Gonna eat that much sugar? I want to enjoy what I'm eating. Like. I don't want to. I'm not going to just open a bag of sugar and start, you know, taking spoons of sugar. I'm gonna eat something decadent. You know something? You naughty a dessert.

00:18:24

Jack

That I really enjoy, and so I wouldn't, I just wouldn't waste the calories on a candy cane, but a piece of chocolate, like one slice.

00:18:32

Jack

Of chocolate orange. I kind of like that. It's it's. It's like an interesting flavor. Like you said that you you said use the expression flavor profile and it's got like orange zest in it, but it's also chocolate. I don't mind that. I wouldn't be able to eat the whole thing obviously, but one slice of it would be.

00:18:52

Jack

You know, kind of perfect.

00:18:54

Xochitl

Right.

00:18:55

Xochitl

Yeah, for sure. How about Christmas cookies or gingerbread man? Now, Christmas cookies are like a sugar cookie with a sugar icing. It's literally just like cream or water and powdered sugar and food coloring that we put on top of Christmas cookies. And the base is just kind of like a vanilla butter sugar.

00:19:17

Xochitl

Cookie base and then gingerbread men have a gingerbread base. Which are it has ginger as one of the seasonings and then it.

00:19:28

Xochitl

Has like treacle or molasses, so like a thick dark sugar as another seasoning and it has a much more spicy.

00:19:39

Xochitl

Kind of flavor. It's heavily spiced.

00:19:42

Xochitl

Yeah, yeah. Which do you prefer?

00:19:45

Jack

You know, I don't mind gingerbread. I mean, I like it. I I can eat that. I think it tastes interesting, but.

00:19:55

Jack

100% give me a Christmas cookie any day. Any day like I I would love. I love Christmas cookies, especially one shaped like a tree.

00:20:04

Jack

Or Santa Claus.

00:20:06

Jack

Or a star.

00:20:08

Jack

UM, you?

00:20:10

Jack

Know those are I I love Christmas cookies. I I like them for the nostalgic purposes and I like the way they taste too. So.

00:20:22

Jack

That's my choice. What about you?

00:20:24

Xochitl

Yeah, I.

00:20:25

Xochitl

I would also.

00:20:26

Xochitl

Pick Christmas cookie just because like you said, Gingerbread. You know, it's interesting. I could. I could.

00:20:32

Xochitl

One and I would enjoy it, but I think Christmas cookies are just they can be too sweet. Which is why when I make my own, I prefer to just do like an outline of icing instead of covering the whole cookie and a sheet of icing. But it's just one of those delights that you could just.

00:20:53

Xochitl

You could eat.

00:20:53

Xochitl

Five in a row easily and not real.

00:20:56

Jack

Ohh yeah yeah yeah, I.

00:20:59

Jack

I I I indulge.

00:21:02

Jack

That's why we don't. I don't have. I don't. We don't. We don't make them here around.

00:21:08

Xochitl

Can't have them in your house? Yeah, usually.

00:21:09

Jack

No, no, no, no, I can't. I can't. It's. But it's such when my mom used to.

00:21:13

Jack

Make them she would make like.

00:21:14

Jack

100 You know I.

00:21:15

Jack

Mean they were. They were everywhere they were.

00:21:19

Jack

You you every time I walk past the kitchen, I I'd grab one or two.

00:21:24

Jack

And head down to watch TV and that's why they call it the holiday 15 or whatever you gain. Like, I guess that's not no, that's the freshman 15. Sorry, I'm using that holiday 5 is what it's called.

00:21:35

Xochitl

Shipping the holiday five, I think maybe.

00:21:40

Jack

The 5 lbs.

00:21:40

Xochitl

Yeah, nowadays it.

00:21:41

Xochitl

Does feel like it could be more like 15?

00:21:44

Jack

Well, it used to be 15 for me probably, but.

00:21:46

Jack

Yeah, I mean.

00:21:47

Jack

I would I always gained a ton of weight around the holiday season because I just ate whatever I wanted and there were. It was. Everything was around. You know, there's just every corner you turn. There's some new treats that my my mom was preparing Christmas cookies.

00:22:03

Jack

Chocolate covered cherries, almond bark.

00:22:07

Jack

I mean, how are you? What?

00:22:09

Jack

Are you going to do is say no to?

00:22:10

Jack

That I mean it's.

00:22:12

Xochitl

Yeah, just especially as a kid. There's, like, so many treats. I remember one time I was at like my.

00:22:19

Xochitl

Dad's like.

00:22:22

Xochitl

Departments Christmas parties. My dad is a professor, and I remember I grabbed like another cookie I already had, like two or three, and then one of the other professors.

00:22:32

Xochitl

He was like watching his children kind of, and he said.

00:22:38

Xochitl

How many have?

00:22:39

Xochitl

You had and I said one.

00:22:40

Xochitl

And he was like, oh, that's the well that.

00:22:42

Xochitl

He's like well.

00:22:42

Xochitl

The perfect answer is 2 because no one will tell you that you can't have another one. And I said, well, the perfect answer is one because.

00:22:47

Xochitl

Then I can have two more, not just.

00:22:49

Xochitl

One and I have. Yeah, I have lied and said only had one already, but I already have three. I'm.

00:22:56

Xochitl

It's just such a kid.

00:22:57

Xochitl

Because there's just like, there's literally mountains of different desserts, like holiday cookies and brownies and.

00:23:04

Jack

Why was that guy? What was he the?

00:23:06

Jack

Cookie please or something.

00:23:07

Xochitl

That's kind of why he was like, I don't know what, why he was on my **** about this, but he was kind of messing with all the kids in the same way. But it was kind of annoying. I was like, bro, you didn't even bring these my laughs as many as I want.

00:23:20

Jack

Yeah, yeah. I don't like that at all. I don't like that. That's like a form of shaming, shaming stuff. Yeah, yeah.

00:23:26

Xochitl

Yeah, for sure it was.

00:23:29

Jack

Else you like to do that to kids and I.

00:23:33

Jack

I never understood.

00:23:34

Jack

What? Why they do that? It's it's really annoying.

00:23:38

Xochitl

Right. What the power trip is about. I mean, kids are there to enjoy the holidays.

00:23:43

Xochitl

They don't, really.

00:23:43

Xochitl

Have to worry about calories the same way we.

00:23:45

Xochitl

Do either they're like.

00:23:46

Xochitl

Running around burning that off pretty much constantly, yeah.

00:23:49

Jack

Sure. Of course, of course.

00:23:52

Xochitl

Yeah, and yeah, it's just it's such a joyous experience because really there's like mountains of brownies, mountains of.

00:24:01

Xochitl

Different types of cookies? Cake. Ohh yeah fudge. There's like the least popular desserts which are like, you know, bourbon cake, fruit cake, bread.

00:24:04

Jack

Ohh fudge my mom used.

00:24:05

Jack

To make comments too.

00:24:18

Xochitl

Pudding with raisins in it.

00:24:21

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:24:22

Xochitl

Things like that. Yeah. And then there's like.

00:24:24

Xochitl

The ones that are kind of like sugary snacks like candy covered pretzels or chocolate covered strawberries, or you know, whatever.

00:24:33

Xochitl

But yeah, there's just such an assortment of different snacks, and I think it's just such a great time, great time to be a.

00:24:39

Xochitl

Kid, because you're like so.

00:24:42

Xochitl

Awestruck by all of this delicious food, and you don't even you're not worried because you didn't have to bring anything to the party. That was your parents job.

00:24:47

Jack

Yeah. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:24:50

Xochitl

So you're just enjoying it.

00:24:55

Jack

Is is the best part of it? I mean, usually those those kinds of holiday parties, nobody cares. Everyone's the adults are are getting drunk and you know, they're drinking. They're drinking a different kind of eggnog, you know, eggnog with some bourbon or. Yeah.

00:25:13

Jack

Alcohol in it, which I always thought was disgusting. I tried that when I was an adult. I I drank the alcoholic eggnog and I was like, why would you?

00:25:23

Jack

Ever ruin eggnog with alcohol?

00:25:27

발표자

You should have.

00:25:28

Xochitl

The one in Mexico's called Rompope and it's like it's much tastier than the eggnog spiked with alcohol here in the US. It's like it's it's thinner and it has, like, more different spices in it. And it's really in the kind of vanilla flavored and it's very tasty. It tastes like a Bay leaves Irish but like.

00:25:46

Jack

Ohh OK then I could get on board probably.

00:25:49

Xochitl

Yeah, it's.

00:25:50

Xochitl

Good. Yeah, but the one here, it's like the texture is kind of wrong for for like the alcohol as well. It like makes it thick and it's already thick. And then it's just like thick and burning your throat at the same time.

00:25:51

Jack

OK.

00:26:02

Jack

Yeah, it's just. Well, it just.

00:26:04

Jack

Has a horrible after taste. It's just like, Oh no thanks.

00:26:07

Xochitl

Yeah, yeah. What did I drink for sure? Alright. Which brings us to our next talking point. Terrible Christmas traditions. Jeff, what is something you think is a terrible Christmas tradition?

00:26:21

Jack

My terrible Christmas traditions. Alright, well, let's see here. I think one terrible Christmas tradition is.

00:26:31

Jack

Like caroling is annoying, right? Like.

00:26:36

Jack

If you're participating in caroling, you're you have to go outside in the freezing cold weather and then you're going to people's houses and singing.

00:26:47

Jack

Uh to them. But they didn't ask for it, so it's unsolicited singing.

00:26:57

Xochitl

And they're kind of interrupting your, like, holiday time.

00:27:00

Jack

Yeah, you're eating dinner or something, and then it's like, oh, hey, Carol, the carolers are here, and then we all have to run out and pretend that we enjoy that they came by, but we're just, like, really hoping they'll leave really soon. And, you know, it's just, it's like, and the carolers are so excited and they think that everybody loves it.

00:27:20

Jack

And it's like, you know, it's like when you're.

00:27:22

Jack

When your toddler.

00:27:24

Jack

Gives you a a artwork from kindergarten or whatever and.

00:27:29

Jack

You like. Look, look what?

00:27:30

Jack

I made you know, and you have to be, like, pretend that it's the most amazing painting ever painted of.

00:27:38

Jack

A horse or.

00:27:39

Jack

Whatever and and, but really, you know it's, you know, it's not genuine.

00:27:45

Jack

I I don't know. I mean maybe.

00:27:46

Jack

Some people enjoy it, they like genuinely enjoy caroling. I just frankly think it's more of like a movie thing. It's like.

00:27:55

Xochitl

A performance thing to like? Uh.

00:27:58

Xochitl

Like we have.

00:27:59

Xochitl

For full term, it's just like a a tradition that people perform it even if they don't want to. Kind of.

00:28:07

Jack

Well, you know the the the thing that.

00:28:09

Jack

My problem with it again is just the intrusion, like going to people's houses and doing it. I kind of like like maybe.

00:28:17

Jack

If you go to.

00:28:18

Jack

A performance like if you go to a church service or something like that and then there's a choir singing some of the Christmas songs.

00:28:27

Jack

Then I I'm like, that's great. I that's what I signed up.

00:28:27

Xochitl

Right.

00:28:30

Jack

Four, but.

00:28:31

Xochitl

Or, if you're like, if Carol, you know.

00:28:33

Xochitl

I think it'd be better if, like the Carroll Group, like went downtown or something, and they were just like downtown kind of busking like, because if you're in the downtown area or whatever, then you would expect to see stuff like that on Christmas and.

00:28:45

Xochitl

It kind of.

00:28:45

Jack

I don't mind that either.

00:28:46

Jack

I don't mind public, public singing around the the holiday season. I'm not a total Scrooge. I'm not like a Bahama bug. I just think it's like the personal intrusion, like I'm in the middle of die hard, you know, it's like a really cool part coming up and then I hear these people singing outside. I can't be rude and ignore them.

00:28:52

Xochitl

Right.

00:29:06

Jack

But I have to humor them, but I don't really appreciate it as much as they think that I appreciate it so.

00:29:13

Jack

You know, you know who appreciates the carolers, our elderly people.

00:29:18

Jack

They just love.

00:29:18

Xochitl

That's true.

00:29:18

Jack

That stuff. So they should just go to elderly people's houses and just put a.

00:29:23

Jack

Smile on on.

00:29:24

Xochitl

Or like Elder like.

00:29:26

Xochitl

They should go to nursing homes. And just like saying I that would be like the most appreciating.

00:29:28

Jack

Yes, go to nursing homes. That's what they they love that don't. Don't.

00:29:33

Jack

Carol on my.

00:29:34

Jack

St. No one, no one cares. Hey.

00:29:36

Xochitl

Yeah, get off my freaking St. we're like.

00:29:38

발표자

Get out of get.

00:29:39

Jack

Off my yard and shake my cane at them.

00:29:41

Xochitl

Yeah, you know, I I I'm not a fan of carolers either. I I the interruption, you know, I think would be a really funny comedy sketch is if you're like, in there arguing with your family and Carol or, like, knock on the door and you have to, like, open the door and like, stop. Yeah, you have to, like, stop for through it.

00:29:56

Jack

What? What do you want?

00:30:01

Jack

Hack the horse with balls of Holly. Shut up.

00:30:05

Xochitl

You hear like glass breaking in the.

00:30:07

Xochitl

Background people like this fighting.

00:30:07

Jack

Yeah, yeah.

00:30:09

Xochitl

I mean, yeah, the intrusion aspect is something that's hard, especially because I think American culture is very individualistic and we don't like, have community in the same way that other cultures do. And I think we.

00:30:24

Xochitl

I I mean, I'm not ********.

00:30:25

Xochitl

On your perspective, I have the same.

00:30:26

Xochitl

Perspective as you I don't want anyone like knocking on my door.

00:30:29

Xochitl

I probably won't answer and.

00:30:34

Xochitl

We don't like, we don't really have that kind of of community aspect and it does feel like an intrusion and you have to suffer through this and then oftentimes part of the tradition is like, you have to offer them like hot chocolate or something to drink.

00:30:50

Jack

Yeah, right. Yeah, some some piggy pudding, yeah.

00:30:51

Xochitl

And then I'll standing around.

00:30:54

Jack

And I'm.

00:30:55

발표자

Like I don't even.

00:30:55

Jack

Know what figgy pudding is? I'm sorry. Like I've never seen it. I've never had it before.

00:31:03

Jack

I couldn't pick a fig out of a police lineup. Probably so.

00:31:11

Jack

Yeah, get off my lawn, you carolers.

00:31:14

Jack

What else is?

00:31:14

Jack

There. What? What's another like horrible Christmas tradition?

00:31:14

Xochitl

Yeah, that is.

00:31:18

Jack

I I I. I'll. I'll.

00:31:19

발표자

Right.

00:31:20

Jack

Give you an example, I have one. I think that you would agree with is like I think this like this idea of parents that just go way.

00:31:28

Jack

Over the top.

00:31:28

Jack

With presents is just is getting out of hand like.

00:31:33

Jack

You know.

00:31:36

Jack

It's like keeping up.

00:31:38

Jack

With The Smiths, we say, right, that expression or.

00:31:41

Xochitl

Like keeping up with the Joneses, you mean?

00:31:43

Jack

As Joe Jones.

00:31:44

Jack

Is sorry not The Smiths. I'm thinking of something else. Maybe I'm thinking of the movie. Mr. and Mrs. Smith. Yeah. Keeping up with the Joneses. That's what I meant to say. It's the the idea that you have to, like, match what your neighbor's doing and do a little bit better. Just, just just to prove to everyone watching how.

00:31:49

Xochitl

You probably are.

00:32:04

Jack

How well you're doing, you know, as far as like, financial?

00:32:08

Jack

Really being financially successful and so you know, I got my kids, an Xbox and new, you know, video game, PlayStation and Ohh well then I got mine, the newer one and you know.

00:32:23

Jack

There's there's one up 11.

00:32:25

Jack

Upsmanship, I don't. I don't like it.

00:32:29

Jack

I I feel like the Christmas has just become and this has been for a long time, way too consumer based, you know, it's just it's all about consumerism. How much can we consume and and stuff that will be in a closet two months from now.

00:32:47

Jack

No, just collecting dust. Just jump.

00:32:51

Jack

And I that that's.

00:32:53

Jack

That's one aspect of of Christmas that I really I I don't know. I I just, it's it's really gotten out of out of control I think. So I I don't like that aspect of of the of the Christmas. I I want I want to get back to to a more.

00:33:13

Jack

Traditional approach to it, which is the the family time it's, you know, a time to not work a time to decompress, spend time with family and really make connections. And like what you said, you're always about the experience presence.

00:33:31

Jack

Why not do something like that, like go skiing or do something as a family and use the money to like do something instead of just buy something. Just always buying dumb stuff.

00:33:44

Jack

Plastic garbage that's gonna end up in the middle of the ocean. A year and a half from now, you know.

00:33:51

Xochitl

Right.

00:33:52

Jack

Yeah, that's my. I'm on my I'm on my soapbox this morning.

00:33:56

Xochitl

I you know, I agree. I agree. Because as you know, I'm a huge proponent of the experience gift. I think experience is there's so much more valuable to us than.

00:34:08

Xochitl

And item like actually getting physical material goods and those memories are something you get to keep forever and in its value only increases with time. Looking back and with the junk you get on Christmas, it's like, OK, well, I'm 30 years, it's going to be any good or.

00:34:28

Xochitl

In you know in 20 in just five years now with with planned OPS leases is probably going to.

00:34:33

Xochitl

Be in the trash.

00:34:34

Jack

I have a Nintendo Wii. It's just collecting dust.

00:34:38

Xochitl

Yep, we gotta pee.

00:34:38

Jack

No. Yeah.

00:34:39

Xochitl

As well, it also collects stuff. We gotta wee for Christmas one.

00:34:42

Xochitl

Year it's collecting dust. We barely we we didn't play it that much to be honest. At the time there weren't that many games for it in the US and like I don't know, I just there's I think.

00:35:00

Xochitl

If I ever have kids, I would like to include them on what would they like to have for Christmas? What would they like to do? You know, if they want some juncture, maybe they can have some junk, but like, wouldn't you rather travel or would you rather go on a ski trip or would you rather?

00:35:21

Xochitl

Go. You know, do something else and and spend that time together and that money more wisely.

00:35:30

Xochitl

Then yeah, they're buying a bunch of junk. I actually haven't gotten presents for anyone this year, and I and I don't want presents from anyone either. I have enough stuff. I just don't want more stuff. I mean, there's.

00:35:43

Xochitl

A couple things.

00:35:44

Xochitl

That people in my life like can need that I'm like oh.

00:35:46

Xochitl

Yeah, I'll get them that.

00:35:48

Xochitl

But like.

00:35:51

Xochitl

If I already have enough things, I don't want more clothes. I don't want like physical items, especially in someone who travels so much it just clutters up your space and.

00:36:02

Xochitl

I don't have like the.

00:36:04

Xochitl

The space to be storing perpetually, storing tons and tons of clothing items. So.

00:36:09

Jack

Right.

00:36:11

Jack

And I find that I I wear the same.

00:36:15

Jack

Thing over and over again anyway, like the the of of my clothing choices.

00:36:20

Jack

I there's a very narrow scope of what I will wear anyway.

00:36:24

Jack

I I mean, I I spent a lot of my time.

00:36:26

Xochitl

Right.

00:36:28

Jack

Just at home wearing like Adidas, an Adidas tracksuit, you know it's like.

00:36:33

Xochitl

Right.

00:36:34

Jack

If I'd have.

00:36:34

Jack

Known. That's all I'd like. I would have just bought like 5 track suits in every color of the rainbow. And that's that's all I'm going to wear.

00:36:41

Xochitl

Right.

00:36:45

Jack

UM.

00:36:46

Jack

Yeah, it's very strange. Why? How we collect stuff that we think we need and then you start to look, go through your stuff and you're like, wow, I I I don't need any of this stuff. I just.

00:36:59

Jack

So I I'm.

00:37:01

Jack

I think the consumerism is 1. You know terrible aspect of.

00:37:06

Jack

Christmas, the the and you know.

00:37:08

Jack

It's been like that for.

00:37:11

Jack

I don't know, 50 years, probably, maybe longer, but it's. But it just seems to get more out of control every every decade. You know, it just gets ridiculous.

00:37:23

Jack

UM.

00:37:24

Jack

And yeah, the other one was, I guess I was, I'm really anti caroling, although compared to consumerism. I'll I'll take caroling over consumerism.

00:37:37

Xochitl

Any day I for me, I guess mine are.

00:37:43

Xochitl

My tradition that I really don't like is in Mexico. There's something called Christmas like salad. I don't know why it's called this. It's a soup, not a salad to begin with. And it's.

00:37:56

Xochitl

It's cold, sweet beet juice.

00:38:01

Xochitl

And that's like the base for the soup. So like bright red and inside it has like chunks of.

00:38:09

Xochitl

Fruit like apples, oranges, jicama and then it has.

00:38:15

Xochitl

Like candied peanuts floating in it too.

00:38:19

Jack

Well, why not at this point?

00:38:21

Xochitl

Yeah, right. And a couple of.

00:38:23

Jack

When it's not there, yeah.

00:38:25

Xochitl

Yeah, a couple other things I don't remember. And and I've just hated it ever since I was a child. I don't think there'll ever be a time where my taste buds will actually like this. And my mom makes a big old pot of it every year. When I was a kid, she would force me to eat a certain amount of it, and I would.

00:38:43

Xochitl

It would be so hard not to barf because it was just the, you know, beat. Jews just doesn't work. It's like.

00:38:49

Jack

You lost me. You lost me at beach juice. To be honest. Like after that. It didn't matter. What was it? It you could be gold bar gold bullion in there. And I don't care after.

00:39:00

Xochitl

That's how I felt. I did not want especially sweet beet juice as like a base it.

00:39:05

Xochitl

Was just it's so.

00:39:06

Xochitl

Bad and and I've never liked this, and my father actually really likes it for some bizarre reason.

00:39:12

Jack

Yeah. Dad's always like that weird have strange palettes like, yeah.

00:39:18

Xochitl

Yeah, they have weird *****, but weird that taste buds for sure but.

00:39:24

Xochitl

I just.

00:39:26

Xochitl

That's probably the worst tradition I can think of is.

00:39:30

Xochitl

Is that and then another I'll I'll add in a little another one here and the last one for me. I think it's having to see family that you don't want to see. And I think this is changing with each generation and my generation does this less now.

00:39:47

Xochitl

But just the idea of how packing your kids up and forcing them to go see Grandma and Grandpa or you know, and it's kind of a time we have such little time off these days, so little vacation time and.

00:40:03

Xochitl

It just feels like it'd be so great to be able to spend that time decompressing or traveling or doing something that you want to do, and instead we spend it seeing family that we sometimes don't even want to see.

00:40:18

Xochitl

Yeah, for real and family, that doesn't necessarily see eye to eye with us or doesn't respect us.

00:40:28

Xochitl

It can be demoralizing to have to spend that little time off seeing people that you don't want to see.

00:40:34

Xochitl

In the first place.

00:40:36

Jack

Yeah. No, that's that's a good point. You know, I don't have that problem. I live in South.

00:40:40

Jack

Korea all.

00:40:40

Jack

Family live in America, so I I never see them, but I know that several of them will not speak to me because of our political differences. And so, you know, it would be.

00:40:55

Jack

Very awkward to try.

00:40:56

Jack

And a have a a a Christmas holiday get together because I know that, you know eventually.

00:41:06

Jack

The conversation will go to politics and I'll express my opinions and they'll, you know, denounce them as.

00:41:17

Jack

Evil and it'll be he'll turn into a huge a huge fight, a huge argument. So yeah, it's it's funny how families are kind of split right now over the very.

00:41:33

Jack

In English, we say polarized political landscape in America.

00:41:40

Jack

And so I I yeah, I I I think you're right like why, why put yourself through that it's like.

00:41:48

Jack

Be because it's a tradition.

00:41:50

Jack

It's like, well, that's a dumb reason to do something you don't want.

00:41:54

Jack

To do you know.

00:41:56

Jack

It's just out of tradition. It's like, well, make a new tradition.

00:42:01

Jack

All right, my new tradition is not putting myself through that painful experience and uh, going on a ski vacation with my, you know, best friend or something. Whatever. You know, there's, there's, I, I think we get, we get stuck in these these ideas like you.

00:42:18

Jack

We have to do it.

00:42:20

Jack

But why?

00:42:22

Xochitl

Right.

00:42:23

Jack

It's not making anyone happy. That's the and the whole point of it is to be joyful and and happy holidays. But if if you, if you're not, if you don't want to be around certain family members, why put yourself in that situation so?

00:42:39

Jack

Yeah, it's it's a. It's an interesting thing. I I think like you said, I think younger generations are starting to go. You know what? I get very little time off. I'm not even going to go home for Christmas. I'm going to spend it with my friends or with my boyfriend, my girlfriend, or whatever. My significant other. We're going to make our own traditions and.

00:42:59

Jack

The heck with the all all the the.

00:43:02

Jack

Old traditions from the 1980s or the 1990s.

00:43:06

Jack

When we don't have to do that anymore and I respect people to do that, I I like that.

00:43:13

Xochitl

Yeah. So Jack's moving on.

00:43:20

Xochitl

I have some other gifts or that type questions.

00:43:24

Jack

Now, yeah, OK.

00:43:26

Xochitl

Which do you prefer? The Grinch movie?

00:43:29

Xochitl

The Grinch cartoon or the new animated Grinch movie, I would guess which of all the Grinch series or movies do you prefer?

00:43:39

Jack

OK, so I.

00:43:40

Jack

Saw the 1969 one. I think it's I I can't remember what year it was, but it's the old Grinch cartoon. It's about 1/2 an hour long. It's about 30 minutes.

00:43:50

Jack

Or 25 minutes long. Then there's the Grinch movie with Jim Carrey, which is a full feature length movie, and it's a live, you know, live action movie of The Grinch. And then they also recently released a kind of Pixar. I don't know if it was Pixar, but like.

00:44:09

Jack

The CG animated Grinch movie.

00:44:12

Xochitl

Yep, I saw that.

00:44:14

Jack

OK. And I never, I haven't seen that one because.

00:44:17

Xochitl

It's not part of it. I've turned it off after a while. I didn't like it.

00:44:20

Jack

Yeah, it looked boring to me and it was like I I think the perfect length for the Grinch story is about 20 minutes or 25 minutes, which and so the Grinch cartoon, I love the animation. It's very loyal to the book, Doctor Seuss's animated style.

00:44:39

Jack

It's it's got a great message. It's funny. It's got really good music. It's got the whole thing. So, and it's also creepy.

00:44:49

Jack

And my my.

00:44:50

Jack

Daughter used to be very scared of.

00:44:52

Jack

The Grinch from that cartoon.

00:44:55

Jack

Because he does look very creepy.

00:44:58

Xochitl

He doesn't.

00:44:58

Jack

That's not as creepy as.

00:45:00

Jack

The Jim Carrey one that's even worse.

00:45:03

Xochitl

Right. The one slur like is the one that got me for Doctor Seuss. I had a dream that the one slur was choking me when I was about like 8 years old. And after that, I never wanted to. I never wanted to read The Lorax again, which is another famous Doctor Seuss story. And I I love The Lorax. Prior to that, I would force my.

00:45:23

Xochitl

I would force anyone who would offer to read to me to read me The Lorax as a child.

00:45:29

Jack

Yes. Again, conservation story, a story of conservation and and you know a great message, but done in a in a super creative way that's this amazing.

00:45:41

Xochitl

Yeah, a very, very creative and fun way.

00:45:44

Jack

Yeah, they they tried to make that into a movie recently too, and it didn't really work again. Like it, it doesn't quite do it.

00:45:53

Xochitl

Yeah, it's like they.

00:45:54

Xochitl

Kind of messing it up. It just doesn't work the same.

00:45:59

Xochitl

Yeah, I I actually am going to go a little against the grain and say my favorite of all the Grinch.

00:46:06

Xochitl

Remastering stations or whatever, it's just the original story.

00:46:10

Xochitl

I just. Nothing beats.

00:46:13

Xochitl

You know, as a kid sitting in, you know, your parents laugh or whatever, having them read you, the Grinch, and just following along with the illustrations, the original illustrations, which are very well done, and you kind of imagine all the different foods they talk about and.

00:46:30

Xochitl

Well, you know and and the Grinch and what he's like. And it just like, nothing beats how vivid A child's imagination is. And I think that that's something really special. So I think for me personally, I would have my kids read the story. I would read it to my kids because.

00:46:46

Xochitl

It's just such a special.

00:46:49

Xochitl

Little story.

00:46:50

Jack

Yeah, go to the source. Yeah. I I think you're probably right. I mean, I can't argue with that. I think the Grinch cartoon from the 1960s is is the second best choice. But yeah, I think reading the story.

00:47:07

Jack

Is is the best?

00:47:09

Jack

Especially when you're.

00:47:10

Xochitl

And I mean.

00:47:11

Xochitl

Ohh sorry, didn't mean to yeah check.

00:47:12

Jack

When you're a.

00:47:12

Jack

Child I. It's the best. It's great.

00:47:14

Xochitl

Yeah, for sure. I I was gonna chime in and say as an adult, I actually watched the Jim Carrey one, but they did not see it as a child. I saw it.

00:47:27

Xochitl

And seeing it as an adult.

00:47:31

Xochitl

It is pretty funny, at least to me, so I did enjoy it. I mean, Jim Carrey kind of has a really physical comedy aspect, so he's kind of wacky, you know, and I think the whole concept worked pretty well with his acting and.

00:47:48

Xochitl

Yeah, I got some laugh out of me seeing it as an adult. I mean as a.

00:47:51

Xochitl

Kid, I think it's like.

00:47:54

Xochitl

It's not going to be as funnier as like.

00:47:59

Xochitl

Entertaining, maybe, but.

00:48:02

Xochitl

As a as an adult I it's kind of similar to watching ELF or something. I really enjoyed it.

00:48:07

Jack

Yeah, yeah, the movie elf is probably one of the best Christmas movies of the last 20 years.

00:48:14

Jack

25 years, yeah, yeah.

00:48:14

Xochitl

Yeah, that is a great Christmas movie.

00:48:17

Xochitl

Yeah. And then Speaking of the Grinch as.

00:48:22

Xochitl

Our listeners may or not.

00:48:23

Xochitl

Or may not be familiar with the Grinch's heart grew three times at Christmas, meaning that he became a much better, warmer, kinder and more empathetic person by the.

00:48:35

Xochitl

End of the story.

00:48:37

Xochitl

So Jack, what makes?

00:48:39

Xochitl

Your heart grow three times during the holiday season.

00:48:44

Jack

Ohh that's a good question. What makes my heart go, Teresa, I'm.

00:48:49

Jack

I'm going to go back to uh, I'm going to go back to the cartoons.

00:48:55

Jack

Because there's one cartoon that makes my heart grow 3 sizes and you, you know this one. It's the Charlie Brown Christmas.

00:49:06

Xochitl

Uh-huh. Never thought all the.

00:49:07

Jack

Have you? Oh, you've never seen the whole thing? Oh, my gosh. OK, this one is.

00:49:13

Jack

It's got the.

00:49:15

Jack

It's got the story and at the end when all the you know, all the kids are singing around the the little Christmas tree that Charlie Brown had bought.

00:49:25

Jack

It was a.

00:49:26

Jack

Such a sad tree, but they dressed it up and and made it look nice.

00:49:30

Jack

Sir. And then they were all singing. I don't know. I I really love that. I think because I I watched it with my daughter when she was young. I would I I somehow downloaded it off of the Internet like 20 years ago or something and or 15 years ago. And so every Christmas, my daughter and I would watch this.

00:49:52

Jack

It's kind of a tradition. We'd watch the Grinch. She didn't like the Grinch that scared her when she was young, but she did love the Charlie Brown Christmas, especially the music.

00:50:05

Jack

And and then that story always kind of gets me, you know, it always kinds of it kind of tugs at my heartstrings and so it kind of makes me my heart grow 3 sizes larger.

00:50:20

Jack

During the holiday season so that I I've kind of, I kind of tightened the our last section to this this last segment here. What about you, what makes your heart grow 3 sizes?

00:50:33

Xochitl

Well, I think.

00:50:34

Xochitl

This Christmas it was. I was just in the shop with my aunt. We were getting like some last minute Christmas lights for the for the.

00:50:45

Xochitl

Bush is outside because some of ours burned out and getting a couple other things we needed at Target, and I walked past these little kids, really little kids who I think were with their grandparents and kids must have been like three and four or something. And the little boy was asking.

00:51:04

Xochitl

You know. Oh, well, you know, if we do this, how will Santa know that this one's for me? And how will Santa know? Like he's asking how Santa would know or be able to figure out.

00:51:14

Xochitl

Certain things and.

00:51:17

Xochitl

It's so cute because you know, as an adult, we know that Santa isn't real.

00:51:24

Xochitl

And it, but it's like such a joy to hear.

00:51:29

Xochitl

Children like.

00:51:31

Xochitl

Caught up in that.

00:51:33

Xochitl

Kind of fantasy of Santa.

00:51:37

Xochitl

It's just so it's so.

00:51:38

Xochitl

Cute and like warm and and fuzzy.

00:51:42

Xochitl

And you hope that they it's almost like it's just the Christmas magic. It's just so real when you're a kid and you're, like, waiting for something to calm and you're so excited you can't even sleep. It's just like the world is such a great place when you're.

00:51:58

Jack

I know, I know that.

00:52:02

Jack

I I missed that that your eyes just wide open at midnight on or, you know, 1159 on Christmas Eve because.

00:52:11

Jack

You're just too.

00:52:11

Jack

Excited to to go to sleep.

00:52:15

Xochitl

I wish you could bottle that.

00:52:16

Jack

And yet you still fall asleep. And then you wake up in the morning and you rub your eyes and you're like, and then you remember it's Christmas morning and you run to the tree. I mean, how great is that? That is the greatest.

00:52:30

Jack

That memory also makes my heart grow 33 sizes, just remembering what it's like to be a kid and then remembering what it was like for my daughter to wake up on Christmas and trying to give that to her. That was.

00:52:42

Xochitl

How did your daughter find out Santa wasn't real?

00:52:45

Jack

Uh, my wife said that. I just.

00:52:46

Jack

Told her one.

00:52:47

Jack

Day and uh, I don't remember doing that, but I probably did. I.

00:52:50

Xochitl

I have to.

00:52:51

Xochitl

Be brutal.

00:52:52

Jack

I know, I just. I just said like, Oh yeah, he's not real.

00:52:57

발표자

Yeah, I don't.

00:52:58

Jack

Know I don't know.

00:52:59

Jack

Why I did that? I.

00:53:00

Jack

Think I felt like she was.

00:53:01

Jack

Old enough to where it was like.

00:53:03

Jack

You know the the the mystery is, is gone. Now it's, you know.

00:53:09

Xochitl

How old do you think she was?

00:53:12

Xochitl

When that happened?

00:53:14

Jack

According to my wife, she was probably.

00:53:17

Jack

9 or 10 but I how about think? Maybe she was like 11 or something. Me a little bit older, you know, in in elementary school it wasn't like she was four or five. And I just, you know, ruined.

00:53:24

Xochitl

Right.

00:53:29

Xochitl

Right. Ruined the match.

00:53:30

Jack

It for.

00:53:30

Jack

Her it was getting close to the time where you start to, you know, they start to hear rumors and innuendo around the.

00:53:38

Jack

The school that uh, Santa may not be real.

00:53:41

Jack

So I just kind.

00:53:42

발표자

Right.

00:53:43

Jack

Of told her. Yeah, it's not real.

00:53:45

Xochitl

You wanted her to hear it from.

00:53:47

Jack

You. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I want her to know that I was the one that stayed up till 2:30 in the morning trying to put the, the, the, the kitchen set together. It was very difficult. I was like, sweating. And it took you needed.

00:54:05

Jack

All these crazy tools to and it would.

00:54:07

Jack

Weigh a ton.

00:54:08

Jack

And you know, it's like a A A.

00:54:11

Jack

Fake kitchen kitchenette.

00:54:12

Jack

You know, area with a refrigerator and all this stuff.

00:54:16

Jack

And ohh man.

00:54:18

Jack

Those days, building those toys, I I do not miss that at all.

00:54:25

Xochitl

Right. Yeah. Well, that's wild. I don't know how. I think my dad also just told me.

00:54:29

Xochitl

Saying I wasn't real.

00:54:30

Xochitl

I was like, I was like ohh. I was like 13 though. But it's not that I didn't think Santa wasn't real already. It was like my sister was older than me and she kept pretending Santa is real so she could keep writing her list to Santa and just like, have my.

00:54:44

Xochitl

Parents give her presents and. Yeah, and so she.

00:54:47

Jack

She's smart.

00:54:52

Xochitl

Was like keep writing your list to Santa and so then we just kept doing that. My dad I think was fed up with us doing that. So he just told that Santa wasn't real. I was like 12 or I must been 12 or 13.

00:55:00

Xochitl

And she was like, 15 or 16/12/15?

00:55:03

Jack

He's like, what do you?

00:55:03

Jack

Want just tell me what you want.

00:55:06

Xochitl

Grow up or whatever, but even.

00:55:10

Xochitl

When I was like 10 or 11, I think I still believed in Santa because.

00:55:18

Xochitl

I remember asking Santa Claus for an older brother because I was tired of my sister picking on me and I was like, you know, if I.

00:55:23

Xochitl

Had an older sibling, I bet that would fix it.

00:55:26

Xochitl

Then have someone to pick on.

00:55:28

Xochitl

Her. So that was my thinking and.

00:55:32

Xochitl

I think it was like probably 10 or so, and I thought of that genius plan.

00:55:35

Jack

Your dad said like I can't deliver.

00:55:37

Jack

This one. So yeah, sorry.

00:55:40

Xochitl

Yeah, younger sibling, maybe older siblings and out of the question.

00:55:42

발표자

And it's not, yeah.

00:55:43

Jack

Yeah, yeah, younger might be possible, but older.

00:55:46

Jack

We're not adopting a A.

00:55:50

Jack

A kid, yeah.

00:55:51

Xochitl

Right. Adopting a child. So yeah, that.

00:55:53

Xochitl

Was all the question.

00:55:55

Xochitl

All right, listeners.

00:55:55

Xochitl

Will let us know what your favorite holiday traditions are in your neck of the woods. And yeah, tell us what you think about our holiday traditions here in the United States. And and yeah. What are some of your favorite holiday movies? Are there certain foods they eat during this time of year?

00:56:17

Xochitl

You know what is something that really warms your heart during this holiday season? Let us know at AZ englishpodcast@gmail.com. Drop us a comment on our website, azenglishpodcast.com and join our WhatsApp Group A-Z English podcast and our WeChat Group and we will see you guys next time.

00:56:38

Jack

Bye bye.

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Transcript:

00:00:00

Xochitl

You are listening to the Jack and Chill podcast.

00:00:13

Xochitl

Alright, Jack, today we are going to be talking about Thanksgiving, which our listeners may or may not know is a family holiday celebrated here in the US.

00:00:23

Xochitl

It traditionally was supposed to commemorate.

00:00:27

Xochitl

Sharing between the pilgrims and Native Americans, of course, we know that.

00:00:32

Xochitl

That's not historically accurate at all.

00:00:35

Jack

Right. Or it's a very oversimplified description of the situation, yeah.

00:00:41

Xochitl

The situation but.

00:00:44

Xochitl

Today, it's kind of divorced from its original meaning mostly, and it's kind of just a family holiday where you eat food together. So.

00:00:53

Jack

Right.

00:00:56

Xochitl

Yeah, I want to ask you, our viewers may or may not know there's some typical things you usually eat during Thanksgiving. I would say Turkey, stuffing, cranberry sauce, mashed potatoes, gravy.

00:01:06

Jack

Mashed mashed. Yeah.

00:01:12

Xochitl

I think those are the ones that like you basically can't skip.

00:01:16

Jack

Right.

00:01:17

Xochitl

And and then each family has. Sorry, go ahead.

00:01:18

발표자 3

It's just.

00:01:21

Jack

No, I was going to say that's exactly right. If there's no stuffing that it doesn't really. It's like that's one really important component of, like, Turkey Mashed potato, stuffing and cranberry sauce like you.

00:01:33

Jack

Have to have.

00:01:33

Xochitl

Like cranberry sauce gravy gotta have that.

00:01:36

Xochitl

And then most people have something green, like a green beans or a salad or some kind of green side. But I would feel those are like the.

00:01:44

Xochitl

Staples. And then each family has things that pretty much just their family makes. Oh, sweet potato casserole or sweet potatoes. And some preparation is another big popular food. Yeah.

00:01:49

Jack

Right.

00:01:55

Xochitl

I would say for the ones that my family makes, it's Kush which is like a cornbread dish with hard boiled eggs and green onion.

00:02:06

Xochitl

And then oysters, which is like oysters, literally strained canned oysters in a casserole dish with like, a bread crumb topping.

00:02:18

Xochitl

It's really good, you know both.

00:02:18

발표자 3

OK.

00:02:20

Xochitl

Of them sound weird, but they're both really delicious.

00:02:22

Jack

Yeah, yeah. I mean we, our, our weird one was lesa because we're the Scandinavian, right? My, my fan no left side is like a a potato pancake with just it just literally has butter on it and then sugar and then you roll it, roll it up. Yeah. I mean it's it's.

00:02:40

Xochitl

That sounds good.

00:02:44

Jack

It's full on, like causes diabetes, you.

00:02:47

Jack

Know what I?

00:02:47

Jack

Mean like you could trace it right back to to that. But but it's so good. It tastes so good.

00:02:48

발표자

Right.

00:02:55

Xochitl

Right. So my oh, and my thing is ever since I started making the Thanksgiving spread pretty much on my own, I started doing this since I was about 24 every year, I pretty much make the whole spread on my own. This year, my mom made the oysters, which were probably the best thing, actually.

00:03:16

Xochitl

Besides that, I've pretty much made everything else myself.

00:03:20

Xochitl

And ever since I started making this spread myself, I only make fried chicken instead of Turkey.

00:03:26

Jack

OK, wow. Alright. A substitution. A different bird. Yeah.

00:03:30

발표자

Yes. Yeah.

00:03:32

Xochitl

Yeah, I just Turkey is like a lot for a kind of smaller family gathering. I don't like the flavor as much. And then for like, one person cooking most of the main dishes, it's really hard for, like, one person to prepare the Turkey on their own pretty much.

00:03:48

Jack

And everyone likes fried chicken.

00:03:49

Xochitl

Is this something?

00:03:51

Jack

I mean you can.

00:03:52

Xochitl

Ohh yeah.

00:03:53

Xochitl

Come on.

00:03:54

발표자 3

You know.

00:03:55

Xochitl

Can't go wrong.

00:03:57

Jack

For for I prefer the Turkey like I'm a I'm a purist. OK, so.

00:03:57

Xochitl

How about you do you?

00:03:58

발표자

Sorry, go ahead.

00:04:03

Xochitl

You're freaking furious. Wow. Betrayed.

00:04:06

Jack

I'm a I'm a.

00:04:07

Jack

Thanksgiving purist like I I need my my Turkey. I I, I and I'm I'm the worst. Like I'm I'm such a typical American that I like the breast like that. You know the white meat which is like everyone knows it.

00:04:22

발표자 3

No, you betrayed.

00:04:25

Jack

That's the least flavor and the and it's the driest part.

00:04:29

Jack

Of the of the bird.

00:04:31

Jack

But I it's just like a tradition, like I when I was a kid, you know, we were picky. We I didn't want the dark meat. I wanted only the, you know, pure the muscle part, you know, just the the whitest of the white meat and a big old slice of it, you know.

00:04:31

발표자 3

That's the.

00:04:51

Jack

Heaping slice of of of dry as.

00:04:55

Jack

White, white meat. Turkey. Yeah. Turkey breast.

00:04:59

Xochitl

Yeah. Yeah, I'm.

00:05:00

Xochitl

The opposite, even as a kid, I always like dark meat, so I'd always want the Turkey leg. And now that I can make it on myself, I'm like, why would I even make Turkey when there's better proteins out there like fried chicken?

00:05:04

Jack

Right.

00:05:12

Xochitl

Yeah, just and.

00:05:13

Xochitl

Then you can.

00:05:14

Xochitl

It's so easy to make gravy with the fried chicken.

00:05:17

Xochitl

Like so. That's just it just knocks out two birds with one stone. Haha. Pun intended.

00:05:24

Xochitl

And yeah, so.

00:05:25

Xochitl

To me. So. So you're on the opposite.

00:05:28

Xochitl

OK, other unpopular Thanksgiving opinion? I did not know. I was on the unpopular end of this one.

00:05:35

Xochitl

I prefer homemade cranberry sauce to canned. I won't even eat the canned stuff. It's nasty.

00:05:40

Jack

No, no, no, no.

00:05:41

Xochitl

How about you?

00:05:42

Jack

I'm again. I'm a purist. I.

00:05:44

Jack

It has to come out of a can. It has to make the like plopping sound.

00:05:48

Jack

You know where you like it, kind of like.

00:05:53

Jack

You know, it falls on the plate. Like if it doesn't make that kind of weird sound when it comes out of the can as it slides out of the can. I'm not eating it. I mean, I'll eat it. Of course I.

00:06:03

Xochitl

Oh my God.

00:06:04

Jack

Would eat it. I'm I'm not.

00:06:05

Jack

I'm not rude, but but I prefer that kind of Jelly cranberry sauce.

00:06:11

Jack

From the can.

00:06:13

Jack

And I don't know. For me, it's like the perfect combination to the kind of salty, savory gravy and mashed potatoes. Then you get that super sweet, almost like a gel, gelatin, kind of cranberry sauce, you know, I know it's really crazy.

00:06:30

Xochitl

Oh my.

00:06:31

Xochitl

God, so I lost.

00:06:33

Jack

Right.

00:06:34

Xochitl

So much respect for.

00:06:35

Xochitl

You I cannot. My dad always.

00:06:38

Xochitl

Made it from scratch and I started making it from scratch. It's so easy. You just open a couple of bags of crap.

00:06:44

Xochitl

Berries with a little bit.

00:06:46

Xochitl

Of water, boil it in a pot with some sugar and I like to add in a little bit of I squeeze half an orange in there.

00:06:53

Xochitl

At the end.

00:06:54

Jack

Oh, a little citrus, a little little, a little zest.

00:06:57

Jack

To it or something a little.

00:06:58

Xochitl

Yeah, a little citrus zest and umm, it is pretty sweet. I try to add enough sugar so that it's not.

00:07:05

Xochitl

Too sour and try.

00:07:07

Xochitl

To make it.

00:07:07

Xochitl

Eat, of course. Cranberries themselves kind of have a naturally bitter sour flavor, like they're also bitter.

00:07:14

Xochitl

You know, but I I just prefer that so much that I honestly, I the canned stuff makes me gag. I hate the texture.

00:07:22

Jack

I love that texture. It's like Jelly or jello.

00:07:22

Xochitl

And it's like.

00:07:25

Xochitl

Oh God.

00:07:26

Jack

Or something gelatin. I know it's.

00:07:28

Jack

It's some gross too.

00:07:30

Xochitl

Oh my God, no I can't.

00:07:35

Xochitl

Go ahead.

00:07:35

Jack

Well, I'm. I'm just trying to think like, why?

00:07:37

Jack

Do I like?

00:07:37

Jack

It do I like it because it makes me. It's because of sentimentality. Or is it because I actually like the taste? And I think it might be a combination of both it.

00:07:48

Jack

That's what we had when I was growing up. So that's what I want. When I have a Thanksgiving dinner.

00:07:56

Jack

But I wouldn't. You know, I would not be disappointed if someone brought in like a homemade cranberry sauce made from scratch. I mean, I'm not. I'm not in insane person. Like, I would definitely enjoy that and appreciate it. I just. I'm totally satisfied with the can. I guess that.

00:07:57

Xochitl

Right.

00:08:14

Jack

And like look.

00:08:15

Jack

Here's the thing about the can.

00:08:17

Jack

It's like.

00:08:19

Jack

It's probably 95% sugar.

00:08:22

Jack

You know, 5% cranberries. You know what I mean? Like, it's probably just a sugar bomb, and that's why it's so sweet. You know, like yours is a much healthier version of it.

00:08:22

Xochitl

It is, it's almost spring.

00:08:33

Jack

You know, and it's probably.

00:08:34

Jack

Got of numerous chemicals in there too. To preserve it, you know, because.

00:08:39

Xochitl

Yeah, to me, get that texture.

00:08:41

Jack

Yeah. Well, the texture that does not exist in.

00:08:42

발표자 3

It's like.

00:08:44

Jack

Nature at all.

00:08:45

Xochitl

Yeah, it's horrible. God congealed.

00:08:45

발표자 3

Just, yeah.

00:08:48

Xochitl

Ohh no, I just can't.

00:08:49

Jack

Yeah. Congeal cranberry juice.

00:08:49

Xochitl

I can't.

00:08:52

Xochitl

Yeah. Oh, my God. No other one. I wanna ask you, Jack.

00:08:58

Xochitl

Pumpkin pie? Is it overrated? And do you prefer another dessert? I didn't make a dessert this year. I had too many other things to do. I personally just. I don't. I didn't want to make pumpkin pie. I was going to use leftover cranberry sauce with apples to make, like, a cranberry apple crumble.

00:09:16

발표자 3

Right.

00:09:17

Xochitl

And I also am thinking I have some cans for like canned pumpkin pie and I was gonna make into like a pumpkin pudding with like layers. You know how people make banana pudding with the layers of cookies. I think I'm gonna make a pumpkin pudding pudding with.

00:09:35

Xochitl

But I just personally don't like pumpkin pie. I feel like the textures texture is always kind of off.

00:09:41

Xochitl

It tastes kind of like tofu or something, and it's like it's not sweet enough. It's just not. It's not.

00:09:47

Xochitl

My cup of.

00:09:48

Xochitl

Tea. How do you feel about it?

00:09:50

Jack

I love pumpkin pie.

00:09:53

Xochitl

We're on opposite, we're on opposite spectrum today.

00:09:56

Jack

We're we're having two completely different meals right now.

00:10:00

발표자 3

Yes. Yeah.

00:10:03

Jack

I. So here's the.

00:10:03

Xochitl

Mine is better. Mine is a better meal.

00:10:04

Jack

Thing when I was a kid, I didn't like pumpkin pie cause I was just like, it's like a it was a vegetable and it's like a vegetable pie, you know, like it.

00:10:13

Jack

It just seemed odd to me because I when I think of pie, I think of fruit pies, right or pecan pie, something like that with with nuts.

00:10:22

Xochitl

And yeah.

00:10:23

Jack

UM, so my mom would always make a pecan pie and A and a pumpkin pie. Or my grandmother would make an apple pie, and I would always choose the apple pie, obviously, because I mean, apple pie is clearly the winner.

00:10:38

Xochitl

I actually don't like apple pie. The texture is nasty to me. It's like hot apples. No thanks.

00:10:43

Jack

Ohh yeah no, I like that too. Yeah, that's that's funny because.

00:10:46

Xochitl

Wow, just like I want to know, at the end of this, all our listeners pause right now and write a comment down below.

00:10:54

Xochitl

Who? This house?

00:10:54

Xochitl

Would you rather eat at mine or Jack? Mine is the right answer. I'll.

00:10:57

Xochitl

Let you guys know.

00:11:00

Jack

If you want, if you want the authentic 1985 American Thanksgiving, you come to my house. But.

00:11:07

Xochitl

Oh my God.

00:11:08

Jack

Social is, you know.

00:11:09

Jack

Younger and you guys are. You know, you've been watching Top Chef for your whole life, you know, so, you know, you guys are like, I'm gonna make a an apple cranberry crumble, you know, with a citrus. Yeah. And.

00:11:11

Xochitl

Do an improved.

00:11:15

Xochitl

That's so true.

00:11:21

발표자

Oh my God, you got me. You got me.

00:11:27

Jack

But I, but I I appreciate I respect it. I I do. I mean, I know that yours culinary yours is a a culinary delight and mine is like a just a traditional kind of gruel like a you know a meal that.

00:11:43

Jack

You know.

00:11:44

Xochitl

You're like big Midwestern energy.

00:11:47

Jack

I do. I I'm.

00:11:47

Xochitl

Like the big white like white.

00:11:50

Xochitl

If you want to like white middle class Midwestern meal, it's like Jack's house is the where it's at.

00:11:55

Jack

Oh my gosh, we are we. We are the epitome of the right white middle class Midwestern, you know, we're big farmers and we like our big birds, you know, like a big Turkey and a giant mountain of mashed potatoes with like, you know, a lava.

00:12:15

Jack

Flow of gravy. You know, coming down that mountain of mashed potatoes with a big old plop of cranberry sauce. And I'm trying to think like, what my.

00:12:17

Xochitl

In the middle.

00:12:25

Jack

My mother used to make.

00:12:27

Jack

This one, you'll know like this is a a traditional 1A sweet potato casserole with marshmallow.

00:12:34

Jack

Melted on the top.

00:12:36

Xochitl

Yes. So my mom and my grandma on my dad's side both make this and I.

00:12:44

Xochitl

I well, my grandma actually has started making it a little differently. She doesn't put the marshmallows on it anymore, but I personally think my sweet potatoes are the best. I mean, I'm kind of arrogant because I definitely think I'm the best cook in the family. My, my grandma actually on my dad's side has some really great recipes. I'm like, I'm gonna hang out around Christmas. I'm definitely gonna collect a bunch.

00:13:02

Xochitl

Of recipes because she has some good ones.

00:13:05

Xochitl

But for me?

00:13:07

Xochitl

I like to make candied yams.

00:13:09

Xochitl

Instead of the sweet potato casserole.

00:13:11

Jack

OK. Yeah, that, that's cool.

00:13:12

Xochitl

And I put.

00:13:12

Xochitl

Like cinnamon and cardamom in it, and it's really good. I I really enjoy it.

00:13:17

Jack

That I would. I would really enjoy that. You know, I I live in Korea now where this. I've never done this before until I lived in Korea. I just eat hate or I like to eat just a plain sweet.

00:13:32

Jack

Yeah, I just put it in the oven. Bake it.

00:13:36

Jack

And I don't add.

00:13:37

Jack

Any sugar I add nothing, and I even eat the skin of it and it's just got lots of fiber and nutrients and you know, it's high in carbohydrates, but.

00:13:47

Xochitl

Yeah, that's popular in Mexico too. There's a thumb up there which is like a guy that sells sweet potatoes, and he goes by and you can hear his sweet potato.

00:13:57

Xochitl

Cart whistling and he goes. Come on, come up.

00:13:59

Jack

Oh, nice.

00:14:01

Xochitl

This and he's.

00:14:02

Xochitl

Like calling out sweet potatoes, sweet potato in that voice and that, like, annoying like, come on. Sounds like that. And people come running out of their houses. Go grab sweet potato. Roasted sweet potato. Yeah.

00:14:05

발표자 3

That's right.

00:14:09

발표자

Yeah, yeah.

00:14:13

Jack

To get a sweet potato.

00:14:16

Jack

I I love them. I think it's great. I mean, you know, it made me think like, why do we?

00:14:20

Jack

Dress up the sweet potato.

00:14:23

Jack

You know, like with with melted, you know, marshmallows.

00:14:24

Xochitl

Right.

00:14:28

Jack

On top it's.

00:14:28

Xochitl

Water is.

00:14:28

Jack

Like putting sugar on sugar. You know what I mean? Like it, it doesn't need. Yeah.

00:14:31

Xochitl

Yeah, it's sweet.

00:14:34

Xochitl

I think my.

00:14:35

Xochitl

Theory about why we do that in the US.

00:14:37

Xochitl

Is that our?

00:14:38

Xochitl

Our viewers have never been the US might not know this or our listeners, but I think the produce is a lot less flavorful in the US, which is crazy because the US has optimal growing conditions. But because of how our food supply chain works, we pick most things before they're fully ripe.

00:14:57

Xochitl

And treat them with a bunch of chemicals so they'll last and they'll have a really long shelf life. And so because of this, most things that you're buying like don't have the sweet, the natural sweetness that they would in other.

00:15:01

발표자 3

Right.

00:15:10

Xochitl

Like in Mexico, if you're going to eat a pineapple or strawberry or something, it tastes really sweet. And in Korea as well, if you have strawberries, they're like, really sweet and delicious and succulent. And in the US, you're gonna get this giant strawberry the size of my.

00:15:23

Xochitl

Fist it's going to be so.

00:15:24

Jack

Right. But it tastes like a glass of water, you know.

00:15:27

Xochitl

It's flavorless. It's like it's like chewing on the.

00:15:30

Xochitl

As of fibrous.

00:15:31

Xochitl

Water. It's nasty.

00:15:33

Jack

Right, right. It looks beautiful. Like a a picturesque strawberry from a commercial that it. It tastes like a like you said. A fibrous glass of water. Like it's just got nothing. Yeah.

00:15:44

Xochitl

Yeah, it's nasty.

00:15:47

Xochitl

Yeah. Anyway, I guess those are unpopular food. Well, you have to tell me first before we, before we transition to the next one. What do you like about pumpkin pie? Because I think I.

00:15:57

Xochitl

Used to I.

00:15:57

Xochitl

Used to pretend to like it as a kid because I felt like I.

00:15:59

Xochitl

Was supposed to like.

00:16:01

Xochitl

It and I really didn't because it's kind of.

00:16:04

Xochitl

Bland and texturally it, it tastes like whipped tofu.

00:16:08

Xochitl

And I like pumpkin, can't in Mexico, we have like candied pumpkin. You cut it into slices and you Stew it with a bunch of, like, brown sugar and spices.

00:16:19

Xochitl

And then you just eat. Eat it.

00:16:21

Xochitl

Like that, and it tastes really good.

00:16:23

Xochitl

Because actually the flavor penetrates it fully, but with pumpkin pie, it's like hard to whip it into pie form and have the flavor fully.

00:16:33

Xochitl

It's not like it's.

00:16:33

Jack

Yeah, if you're making it from scratch, you know, like, like there there, you could make it like you can just buy the already whipped up.

00:16:33

Xochitl

Like not speeding much.

00:16:43

Jack

Pumpkin, I don't know what you call, like the filling part, right? You can buy it in.

00:16:47

Xochitl

Yeah, but I'm sure that's how you guys made it back home, right? Because, well, my my dad actually made it from scratch sometimes, and I that was even worse. It tasted like stringing. It's totally. Yeah. Like it isn't worth it. Look, stringy, pumpkin. Ohh. No, I just.

00:16:51

Jack

I'm sure.

00:16:56

Jack

More like pumpkin.

00:17:03

Jack

Don't. Don't use leftover Jackal Lantern.

00:17:06

Xochitl

Then my dad did that. My dad would literally do that would use like leftover Jack Lynch and he would like, freeze it or something and then just like, make like five of the.

00:17:14

Xochitl

Later it was.

00:17:14

Xochitl

Like stringy. Ohh God.

00:17:16

Jack

Yeah, that's right.

00:17:18

발표자 3

What do you?

00:17:19

Xochitl

Yeah. What do you like about pumpkin pie though cause?

00:17:22

Xochitl

I feel like.

00:17:23

Xochitl

You like when you buy it in a can form or you buy it premade from the store. That's like the best version and it's.

00:17:28

Xochitl

Still not good to me.

00:17:29

Jack

Because it's it's loaded with.

00:17:30

Jack

Sugar, I think all of these things are are just completely loaded the sugar. So I I like pumpkin pie because, well, actually I didn't start liking it till.

00:17:43

Jack

I was an adult. It's kind of.

00:17:44

Jack

Like one of those things that I grew into. So I started with.

00:17:50

Jack

You know, eating just apple pie or pecan.

00:17:53

Jack

Pie. When I was a kid.

00:17:55

Jack

And then as an.

00:17:56

Jack

Adult. I'm like I'm going to try a slice of pumpkin pie. I like it with whipped cream on top, which is kind of cheating, right? It's like I. What do I like more? Do I like the pumpkin or do I like the whipped cream? But if you get if you get a a.

00:18:05

Xochitl

Yeah, my sister covers everything.

00:18:11

Jack

If you get whipped cream and pumpkin pie together.

00:18:13

Jack

In one on the spoon.

00:18:15

Jack

Then it's tolerable.

00:18:19

Jack

But like, I think you're right.

00:18:20

Jack

I think pumpkin.

00:18:21

Jack

Pie is like at its best is just tolerable.

00:18:24

Xochitl

It's like mid, you know, slang in mid like it's just in the like mid range like it's not amazing, it's not horrible. It's just mid like the best pumpkin pie is mid to me.

00:18:34

Jack

Right, right. The best one big pie is is is is.

00:18:38

Jack

Not better than the worst blueberry pie, yeah.

00:18:39

Xochitl

Of great.

00:18:41

Xochitl

Yes. Oh, my God. Blueberry pie is my favorite. I like to make that for Christmas though. But yeah, I was gonna. That was.

00:18:45

Jack

Yeah, blueberry pie.

00:18:47

Xochitl

Going to be my other question to you is like, do you eat it loaded with with, with with cream which?

00:18:52

Xochitl

You said you.

00:18:53

Xochitl

Do because my sister. That's how she eats it. She just. She's like eating whipped cream pie with some pumpkin on it. And. And just like at that point, you do, you just like to have an excuse to eat a ton of whip cream that has, like, a slight.

00:19:08

Xochitl

And slavery.

00:19:11

Jack

You know, I I actually.

00:19:13

Jack

I do enjoy it like I like.

00:19:15

Jack

When you when you.

00:19:16

Jack

When you get like.

00:19:18

Jack

Like I said, like a like a spoon of whipped cream and a bit of pumpkin filling and then some of that nice breaded crust.

00:19:27

Xochitl

Yeah, the question is.

00:19:27

Jack

It all in one.

00:19:28

Jack

Bite it is a very.

00:19:29

Jack

Nice like I do like it. I do. It's.

00:19:32

Jack

Like I'll I'll.

00:19:33

Jack

I'll really enjoy a Costco pumpkin pie with my wife, like we'll get the the whipped cream and we'll buy the pumpkin pie and I'll have a slice. You know, every night until it's gone, you know.

00:19:47

Xochitl

Right.

00:19:49

Jack

You're right. Like, I mean, if I were, you know, of all the pastries that you could choose in the world, why, why do we choose pumpkin pie? I think again, it's. It goes back to, like, sentimentality. It kind of reminds me of home. It, like, makes me feel like I'm back in America eating a Thanksgiving dessert.

00:20:09

Jack

So it's more like a nostalgic eat than like a ohh this is the taste is wonderful. Like I just love the taste, which is kind of stupid. I mean it's it's a weird thing to eat.

00:20:21

Jack

For nostalgia purposes, then to.

00:20:24

Xochitl

But it's such a.

00:20:25

Xochitl

Specific flavor. It's like of course that it would bring up, because if you're eating like a hot dog, I mean, you can get that anywhere kind.

00:20:33

Xochitl

Of but like.

00:20:34

Xochitl

Or, you know, Mac and cheese, but it's just brings back a certain holiday memory to have the pumpkin pie.

00:20:41

발표자 3

I think that's.

00:20:42

Jack

What it is? I mean, it's like it's like eating a a childhood memory like. But it's the. But The funny thing is I never started eating pumpkin pie till I was an adult. So it's just like, put the smell and and I don't know.

00:20:50

Xochitl

An yeah.

00:20:56

Jack

I've I've probably had a few.

00:20:56

발표자

The memory.

00:20:57

발표자 3

This is.

00:20:58

Xochitl

Yeah, when you're eating it, it just reminds you of Thanksgiving, which is an logic memory for us in the US, yeah.

00:21:02

발표자 3

Right.

00:21:05

Jack

Yeah, I've only had. I've only had maybe 2 Thanksgiving meals in the last 20.

00:21:13

Jack

Four years probably. I remember I had a neighbor from America and he invited me over on Thanksgiving, and he was trying to make a Thanksgiving.

00:21:23

Jack

You know in Korea and he was an American guy. He was worked on the military base, so he got a bird. Sorry, we bird is slang for Turkey.

00:21:33

Xochitl

For tricky.

00:21:34

Jack

Yeah, that's how.

00:21:35

Jack

Midwest, am I right now he. So he got a Turkey and he got a bird and made mashed potatoes and stuff and we.

00:21:39

Xochitl

We got a burn.

00:21:43

Jack

But it was really awkward like.

00:21:44

Jack

I didn't really want to.

00:21:45

Jack

Be there. I was just like I.

00:21:47

Xochitl

Ohh no wait. Why was it awkward? Because.

00:21:50

Xochitl

This brings us to our next.

00:21:50

Jack

I wasn't really close to him that much.

00:21:52

Jack

I think he was trying to like reach out and and I was just kind of like, you know, my wife's not here. She was at work and I'm.

00:21:59

Jack

Just sitting there.

00:22:00

Jack

At this like guys house eating Thanksgiving food.

00:22:03

Jack

Good. But we're we're we're both.

00:22:05

Xochitl

Are you with anyone else?

00:22:07

Jack

No, it was just like me and him. And like his kid, I think was there maybe his wife. I can't. No. Yeah, it was really awkward. And I was just like.

00:22:11

Xochitl

That's really awkward.

00:22:17

Jack

Yeah, I I was. We were.

00:22:18

Jack

We were both just trying to to recreate our own childhood memory, you know, to go back to our past and try to create something over here. And I I realized that it's just not. You can't do it. Like it doesn't work. You have to. You need a you need a group of people.

00:22:37

Jack

That are all really gung ho, like excited about.

00:22:43

Jack

About trying to be creative Thanksgiving. So what you need is like a lot of foreigners, you know. And so when you get a lot of foreigners together, they'll they'll put together a big old like you said, a spread like a spread. It's like a a lot of a lot of different foods. And you can do a big Thanksgiving feast. But.

00:22:48

Xochitl

Right.

00:22:55

Xochitl

Right.

00:23:03

Jack

When it's just.

00:23:03

Jack

Like me, I tried to do that with my daughter.

00:23:06

Jack

And my wife. But it was just it's it's just too difficult so.

00:23:11

Jack

I just said you.

00:23:12

Jack

Know what? We'll we'll celebrate the Korean Harvest Festival, which is the tussock holiday and all.

00:23:21

Jack

You know, forget about the Thanksgiving one, but hopefully someday in the future, before I die, I would love to go back and have, like, a proper Thanksgiving dinner in America. That would be. That's one of my dreams.

00:23:37

Xochitl

No matter where I am, I always make the Thanksgiving. So I wasn't in Korea for that Thanksgiving, but I was in Mexico, and I did make the spread, but it was just me doing it by myself.

00:23:49

Xochitl

And one of my friends who came, like, insulted my food. I really wanted to kick her out at that point. I was like, don't insult like it just made me so mad because I worked so hard to make everything. And yeah, it was really mean.

00:23:59

Jack

That's awful. What?

00:24:03

Jack

Does she doesn't understand Thanksgiving or she's she's not American?

00:24:07

Xochitl

She doesn't know she's not American, but I don't.

00:24:10

발표자 3

OK.

00:24:11

Xochitl

I don't know. It was just it was weird, but I think later she felt bad about it. But I was like, I was mad. I.

00:24:16

Xochitl

Was like OK.

00:24:17

Xochitl

Well, you don't have to eat.

00:24:19

Jack

You just pulled the.

00:24:20

Xochitl

It just like, yeah, so.

00:24:20

Jack

Mom card. Well, then yeah, no desserts for you. No, pumpkin pie. No pumpkin crumble. Crumble cake for you.

00:24:29

Xochitl

OK.

00:24:29

Xochitl

But the thing that I did mess up and this was before she even got to that part. So this is not what she was criticizing. I undercooked the chicken.

00:24:38

Xochitl

My God, it was so funny because I didn't realize the the elevation makes cooking time for meat and everything different.

00:24:46

Jack

No, I didn't know.

00:24:47

Xochitl

Yeah. I mean, no. Yeah, I didn't know that. And so the chicken was like undercooked, but it still went well, I think, because the sides were all really delicious, even though the the chicken was undercooked. And my boyfriend came the next day, and he we have leftovers together. And he really liked the food. And I reheated the chicken, so it cooked.

00:24:47

발표자 3

That either.

00:25:07

Xochitl

All the way through.

00:25:08

발표자 3

So it's like.

00:25:08

발표자

Yeah, they.

00:25:09

Jack

Yeah. You don't wanna give anyone the.

00:25:10

Jack

Hot chicken well.

00:25:12

발표자 3

The thing that.

00:25:12

Jack

I think we're forgetting about Thanksgiving is the leftovers.

00:25:16

Jack

Because there's nothing like a the the Turkey sandwich. You know, the Turkey gravy sandwich the next day. So you take a piece of bread and you heat up the uh, you heat, you heat up the Turkey and you heat up the the gravy and then you put the Turkey on the bread and then you do pour.

00:25:38

Jack

Gravy on it and it soaks into the bread.

00:25:41

Jack

And then you.

00:25:41

Jack

Eat that Turkey sandwich with the the bread you know soaked the gravy soaked bread and that is even better than Thanksgiving.

00:25:54

Jack

In my.

00:25:55

발표자

Right.

00:25:56

Xochitl

Yeah. See, I've never eaten leftovers like that. I hear a lot of Americans eat like the Turkey sandwich and stuff for us. We would just reheat everything and eat it again. Yeah, but it's so good because sometimes flavors, like, have a chance to meld more together in a dish within a dish. Like.

00:26:13

Xochitl

And so the next day.

00:26:13

Jack

They just gets better and better.

00:26:16

Xochitl

Yeah. It's like more flavorful. So yeah, I I really like the leftovers, and I think it's the best part is like, you can eat.

00:26:22

Xochitl

That food for.

00:26:23

Xochitl

Like 3 days and you don't have to worry about making new food. One thing I like to do is just like add on. So since I do everything by myself now.

00:26:31

Xochitl

I do things in.

00:26:32

Xochitl

Shifts. So like the first round was like.

00:26:35

Xochitl

Fried chicken, mashed potatoes, stuffing, oysters, green beans, cranberry sauce and the 2nd shift was like sweet potatoes. Kush like just I made different dishes each so we could just like bring them together.

00:26:49

Jack

Right.

00:26:50

Xochitl

The next day.

00:26:50

Jack

You know, it's, uh, it's the best. I mean I it I.

00:26:54

Jack

Know a lot of people.

00:26:56

Jack

My friend Kevin, you, you know, Kevin, his favorite holiday is Thanksgiving by far, like he likes it more than Christmas. He likes it more than any other holiday. I think it's because of that, like eating and drinking together and the.

00:27:12

Jack

I don't know it it.

00:27:13

Jack

Puts you in a like.

00:27:14

Jack

You know it's supposed to be a.

00:27:15

Jack

Time where you reflect.

00:27:17

Jack

On the year and you're thankful for.

00:27:21

Jack

The things that you have, you know, and I think we forget about that because.

00:27:25

Jack

Because the very next day after Thanksgiving is probably the the the lowest point culturally for us, which is the Black Friday where it's all about consumerism and excess. And you know it's about fist fighting over a, a television that's on, you know, sale.

00:27:35

Xochitl

Oh my.

00:27:45

Jack

You know, I mean it's like.

00:27:48

Jack

So it's funny how we we flip flop from like this. Really thankful kind of thoughtful mode to the kind of aggressive shopping mode of Black Friday. And so I I think people forget, you know, I I don't.

00:28:06

Jack

Know that's.

00:28:07

Jack

I I love Thanksgiving because I I love the food and I love the family. And yeah, it was it. It is a a wonderful holiday. I do. I do love it.

00:28:20

Xochitl

We are kind of forgetting about the other side of the coin though, which is like Thanksgiving family drama, which I feel like always comes out during those times. I saw this really funny meme. That's like, remember to bring up politics during Thanksgiving so you can save on Christmas presents. That was.

00:28:28

Jack

Right.

00:28:41

Xochitl

I've I think I've had drama every year. Probably my family's a little bit dramatic this year. I got mad because I actually get mad most years.

00:28:51

발표자

That's not new.

00:28:53

Xochitl

This year I got mad because I.

00:28:53

Jack

You cook the food and then you storm off, right?

00:28:56

Xochitl

Yeah, I like made all the food and then today.

00:29:02

Xochitl

I guess it wasn't Thanksgiving anymore, but I think we had a fine Thanksgiving, but then it wasn't Thanksgiving anymore. Today we were, like, reheating stuff.

00:29:10

Xochitl

But I was that.

00:29:10

Xochitl

We were doing it in shifts, so I was supposed to make like.

00:29:12

Xochitl

The stuffing and.

00:29:13

Xochitl

Some other stuff today and I was all ready to do.

00:29:16

Xochitl

It. But my grandma like.

00:29:19

Xochitl

Was mean. I don't know why she gets in like a bad mood. And this is on my mom's side. And so she like said like.

00:29:28

Xochitl

Oh my God. Are you going to make more food or something? And it just made me.

00:29:32

Xochitl

It just like, hit a nerve and like, well, you don't have to eat it.

00:29:36

Jack

Right, right.

00:29:37

Xochitl

You can just eat your own food if you want.

00:29:39

Xochitl

Like you know what I mean? Like.

00:29:40

Xochitl

I wasn't making it for her specifically. There's more other people.

00:29:44

Jack

No, it's just it was just kind.

00:29:46

Jack

Of a crappy thing to.

00:29:47

Jack

Say cause it's just like, well, like why?

00:29:51

Jack

Yeah, no one's.

00:29:53

Jack

Forcing food down your your throat, you know it's.

00:29:55

Xochitl

Yeah, no one's.

00:29:56

Xochitl

Trying to make you eat it.

00:29:57

발표자 3

Yeah, yeah.

00:29:59

Xochitl

So I was like, well, you don't have to eat it. Yeah, I was mean. So that made.

00:30:02

Xochitl

Me upset and then?

00:30:05

Xochitl

I said I wasn't making it anymore. I got mad and said I wasn't making. I wasn't cooking anymore, and then I just didn't cook. My mom supported me and said I didn't have.

00:30:12

Xochitl

To cook, I was like.

00:30:12

Xochitl

Alright, good. Me too we.

00:30:14

Xochitl

Cook. I just it just. I think sometimes it makes me mad and I understand. Like now I kind of see things through a different lens now that I'm older and that the responsibility of making all the food is.

00:30:29

Xochitl

I get why?

00:30:30

Xochitl

Women would get so like angry and frustrated during the holidays when I was a kid, like you would see your mom getting.

00:30:35

Xochitl

Mad and stuff. And you're like you now you realize like, OK, because a lot of people are really unappreciative of all the work that you're putting in to make.

00:30:43

Xochitl

All this food.

00:30:45

Jack

Right. And my family's traditional. So my my grandmother, my mom and my aunt, they would all make the food. Although my uncle would make the bird, he would cook the Turkey. He's kind of like at, you know, like, like putting water on it and whatever.

00:30:59

Jack

The you know.

00:31:01

Xochitl

You're basing it? You mean? Yeah, yeah.

00:31:01

Jack

Pasting it like pasting the Turkey.

00:31:04

Jack

UM.

00:31:05

Jack

And uh.

00:31:06

Jack

So and then afterwards, the men would just sit and watch football and the women had to do all the cleaning as well, so they would be cleaning up in the kitchen and preparing the dessert.

00:31:12

Xochitl

Yeah, and drink beer.

00:31:17

Xochitl

God yeah.

00:31:21

Jack

For the men and I'm, I'm like, you know, it seemed normal to me at this time and so.

00:31:27

Xochitl

It never seemed normal to me. It made me mad, like ever.

00:31:30

Xochitl

Since I think I was always like.

00:31:31

Jack

Yeah. Well, because I'm, you know, I'm the I'm the lucky gender. You know what I mean? Like, I'm the beneficiary of, like, all this, this tradition, it's like.

00:31:31

Xochitl

Why is everyone? Why the men? Just.

00:31:35

Xochitl

Right.

00:31:41

Jack

What? What do you what?

00:31:42

Jack

Do young boys learn they?

00:31:43

Jack

Learn to that women do the cooking and the cleaning.

00:31:47

Jack

And the men do the eating and the football watching.

00:31:49

Xochitl

Drinking and the football watching. Yeah. And the I had the same thing happened with my grandma. Another.

00:31:51

발표자 3

Yeah, right.

00:31:59

Xochitl

Year which is I made all the food. My dad insisted she didn't want to have a Thanksgiving. This is my grandma. My mom's side. Again. She want to have Thanksgiving because she says that it.

00:32:06

Xochitl

Always ends badly or something and.

00:32:10

Xochitl

My dad insisted that he wanted to do it, but I ended up having to make all the food my dad made like one dish. But I made. I had to make everything else, and then we brought it and then she was like, oh, this is so nice.

00:32:20

Xochitl

Thank you so much, Tad. Like to my dad.

00:32:23

Xochitl

And I was like.

00:32:27

Xochitl

I was so mad and then my dad did to his ever living credit at least say I didn't make anything. Uh, my daughter made everything. But my grandma already knew.

00:32:34

Jack

Right.

00:32:35

Xochitl

That so it.

00:32:36

Xochitl

Was just like insult to injury. At that point, I.

00:32:39

Xochitl

Was like I.

00:32:40

Xochitl

Think it just, it sucks when you make all those food for people and they don't appreciate it. I think that's what like is hard for women too.

00:32:46

Xochitl

Like you're under feeling unappreciated for all the effort you put in, cause it's a lot of work to plan everything, all the ingredients and do it all.

00:32:55

Jack

There's there's a trend. I mean, I read articles about this in Korea. So Korea has a a harvest festival called the Chusak holiday. And women are so responsible for everything that they some, some women actually faked like injuries.

00:33:15

Jack

Like you would wear like a cast on their arm or something. They're like, oh, I I broke my arm. I can't, you know, attend. I can't do the, you know, the holiday because the holiday.

00:33:19

발표자

Oh yeah.

00:33:28

Jack

It's like it's like worse than your job. It's like a it's like going from what we say. We have an expression in English, like, out of the frying pan, into the fire, kind of. That's the expression. So it's kind of like you get your time off.

00:33:42

Jack

From work to work harder.

00:33:45

Jack

Catering this you know to the needs.

00:33:48

Jack

Of all the men in the family.

00:33:49

Jack

Like cooking and cleaning and nonstop food preparation and cleaning and childcare.

00:33:55

Jack

And all these things.

00:33:57

Jack

Now I think in recent years, though, it's starting to change, you know, like I think.

00:34:03

Jack

That men are starting to realize, like, OK, if if women are going to work full time jobs.

00:34:10

Jack

Then it's only fair to split the the cleaning and the cooking duties. 5050, you know what I mean? Like it's just it's it. That's the lesson that young kids should be learning. Is that like, you have to cooperate together and you know, prepare this this meal. And so I don't know what it has happened in my family.

00:34:31

Jack

Because my family is so spread out now, I think they have their new families, you know? So like all the cousins.

00:34:39

Jack

They all have their family with my aunt and uncle together, and now my aunt, uncle are the grandma and Grandpa and the same with my other family and my parents and my parents are the only ones that really get left out because both of their kids, my brother and I live, you know, thousands of miles away.

00:35:00

Jack

So they so they, we never celebrate Thanksgiving together. And so it's it's one of those things where my you know, when it comes to.

00:35:09

Jack

Like the drama of the family I like.

00:35:13

Jack

I if if we had like a traditional Thanksgiving where it was like all my my aunts and uncles together now after Donald Trump has been elected, it would be.

00:35:24

Jack

On a like a knock down, drag out battle of like like we'd have to. We have to set ground rules like. No, we will not discuss politics.

00:35:36

Jack

Because, because they're, they won't even talk to me right now. Like they they they haven't talked to me.

00:35:36

Xochitl

Right.

00:35:42

Jack

In like years.

00:35:44

Jack

Like if I if I send them like like a if I send like a message.

00:35:44

Xochitl

But being less me.

00:35:47

Jack

To them like, hey, happy birthday. Radio silence.

00:35:51

Jack

Just nothing, you know, so.

00:35:53

Xochitl

Yeah, I mean.

00:35:54

Xochitl

Honestly, you're better off without racist people in your life.

00:35:57

Xochitl

Though I mean.

00:35:57

Xochitl

To me, in my opinion, but you know, it is what it is, but I get it. Yeah, I think that a lot of the modern times are the holidays. Just don't hit the way they used to. Like it just hit different now, like.

00:36:13

Xochitl

They're not. I feel like holidays used to be such a thing.

00:36:18

Xochitl

And now it just feels really watered down and I can't tell if it's because I'm getting older or if times are just changing. I feel like it's both probably.

00:36:26

Jack

I think times are changing. I think people are like realizing like, OK, I've got I work hard and I've got this, this this week off or these three days off and like do I want to be miserable with my family or happy with my friends. And I think young people like millennials and.

00:36:42

Xochitl

Yeah, fighting out.

00:36:47

Jack

And Gen. Z people are like you know what? I'm already.

00:36:48

Xochitl

And the.

00:36:53

Jack

I'm already getting screwed over in the economy.

00:36:55

Jack

Like I'm not making enough money. I'm you know.

00:36:58

Jack

Now I gotta fly home.

00:37:01

Jack

To to to deal with.

00:37:01

Xochitl

Right.

00:37:02

Jack

This nonsense, you know, so to listen.

00:37:05

Jack

To my uncle.

00:37:06

Jack

You know, talk about how great Donald Trump is, you know, to, you know, I mean, why would I go home to that? Like I would, you know, so I think I think young people are are are creating their own holiday traditions within their friend group friend groups.

00:37:10

Xochitl

Right. Don't.

00:37:10

Xochitl

Do that.

00:37:23

Xochitl

I'm not feeling.

00:37:25

Xochitl

Thinking myself.

00:37:28

Xochitl

After having done the holiday spread three years in a row and never having been appreciated for it once, not once did anyone ever say wow. Thank you. You disagree affected 4 years because it was. I did it when I was 242526 and now 27. So it's technically four different Thanksgiving that I did completely by myself.

00:37:46

Xochitl

And never, ever anyone ever seemed appreciative at all. At that point, I'm like next time I'm just saving my grocery money and my time and going on a trip somewhere.

00:37:56

발표자

You're going.

00:37:57

Xochitl

Going to bother with it. That's how I.

00:38:00

Jack

Yeah, go on a cruise or something.

00:38:03

Jack

Or go to.

00:38:05

Jack

You know? Yeah, the nice.

00:38:07

Xochitl

I don't even get an Airbnb in like the next town over and just drink wine.

00:38:13

Xochitl

Like that all day? Not really.

00:38:15

Xochitl

But it's just it's so.

00:38:18

Xochitl

Kind of demoralizing, I get why people don't want.

00:38:20

Xochitl

To deal with.

00:38:22

Xochitl

Deal with it anymore, in a way.

00:38:23

Jack

Yeah. No, I'm I, I agree 100%. I think it's good, you know? Yeah. Maybe like it's too much. It's it's too much family. It's it's too much, you know, Thanksgiving and then Christmas.

00:38:36

Jack

Is right around.

00:38:37

Jack

The corner I think for for young people in their 20.

00:38:41

Jack

One of the one is OK, like just do a Christmas and forgo the Thanksgiving or do the Thanksgiving and skip the Christmas. I don't know, but I think it's OK, yeah.

00:38:46

Xochitl

The thing is.

00:38:53

Xochitl

Yeah, I did.

00:38:54

Xochitl

Thanksgiving this year, with my mom's family and I am doing Christmas with my dad's family because my grandpa passed away. So.

00:38:59

Xochitl

I want to see my grandma, but next year I'm saving my money both times and just going on a vacation some other time, just like I don't want to be.

00:39:00

Jack

Right.

00:39:13

Xochitl

I just don't want to be here and deal.

00:39:16

Xochitl

Comments and have to make all the food and just at the end of the day, no one is happy. It's like I wasn't happy. I put in all this effort and no one appreciated it, and apparently they're not happy that I did all of that. So I'd rather just save my money and go on a on a cruise or a.

00:39:32

Xochitl

Trip or something, you know, at the end of the day.

00:39:33

Jack

Yeah. Yeah. Well.

00:39:36

발표자 3

I mean, I think that's that's that's.

00:39:37

Jack

Fair. You know, like it's if it's not fun, it's not happy.

00:39:43

Jack

Why are we? We're just doing it. We're just going through the motions of it for no reason. You know? It's just like because because we have to. I think that's what people realize. I think it's what young people in America realized is like, oh, wait, I don't have to do this.

00:40:00

Jack

Like nothing is gonna happen, you know, like nothing bad is going to happen. I'm not going.

00:40:03

Xochitl

If I don't.

00:40:05

Jack

To get struck.

00:40:06

Jack

By lightning, if I don't go home for Thanksgiving, but we're so conditioned as children to like.

00:40:14

Jack

Follow these these traditions and you know it's they're they're just traditions like you. You can break them. That's fine. Like there's no nothing bad will happen.

00:40:26

Jack

You know it's your family.

00:40:27

Xochitl

Yeah. And then have something good on.

00:40:28

Jack

They still have.

00:40:28

Jack

To love you, you know.

00:40:29

Xochitl

Right, exactly.

00:40:32

Xochitl

So yeah, I don't know. I think for all the young people out there, if you're not feeling it this holiday spirit, you know, don't and don't feel like you're selfish because of it. I think that.

00:40:43

Xochitl

We get to.

00:40:43

Xochitl

A little time to relax and actually have vacation and stuff nowadays. It's like you gotta take every chance that you can get.

00:40:50

Jack

Yeah, yeah, I I agree with that, you know.

00:40:55

Xochitl

All right. Well, if you have a holiday similar to Thanksgiving or Harvest Festival in your culture, tell about it with us. If you also celebrate Thanksgiving, let us know how it's going for you. Do you agree that women usually have to do most of the work? I definitely agree you think. Are you down with that? Are you happy about that?

00:41:11

발표자

And the.

00:41:15

Xochitl

Or do you actually want to?

00:41:18

Xochitl

Stop following the tradition and go on vacation next year or go treat yourself next year. Yeah, and let us know who's house you'd rather eat at mine or jacks, I think.

00:41:28

Xochitl

Mine is the.

00:41:28

Xochitl

Right. One you.

00:41:30

Xochitl

Want to get on my good side say.

00:41:31

Xochitl

My my house.

00:41:34

Xochitl

Yeah. And then leave a comment down.

00:41:35

Xochitl

Below and we will see you guys next time.

00:41:38

Xochitl

Make sure follow our podcast Jack and Chill podcast. Check what is our e-mail on our website.

00:41:42

발표자

What you mean?

00:41:44

Jack

So our website is A-Z englishpodcast.com so we're.

00:41:48

Jack

Still using the.

00:41:49

Jack

A-Z englishpodcast.com website but.

00:41:49

발표자

OK.

00:41:52

Xochitl

Right.

00:41:52

Jack

You can send us an e-mail.

00:41:54

Jack

You know A-Z English.

00:41:55

Jack

Podcast@gmail.com.

00:41:57

Jack

Or the Jack and chill podcast@gmail.com. Both of those are OK.

00:42:03

Xochitl

Yeah. And we'll see you guys next.

00:42:04

Xochitl

Time. Bye bye.

00:42:05

발표자 3

Bye bye bye.

Intro/Outro Music: https://freemusicarchive.org/music/Broke_For_Free/Directionless_EP/Broke_For_Free_-_Directionless_EP_-_05_Mells_Parade/

https://freemusicarchive.org/music/holiznacc0/power-pop/mutant-club/

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https://freemusicarchive.org/music/holiznacc0/power-pop/mutant-club/

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If you would like us to discuss a specific topic or offer some language or life advice, send us an email at thejackandchillpodcast@gmail.com. We'd love to hear from you!

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